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Author Topic: Lancia superjolly Arca Camper  (Read 7889 times)
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Dikappa
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« on: 08 December, 2013, 01:14:31 PM »

Yesterday we had our annual Lancia Club dinner here in Belgium, and it turned out other members had digital photo's of the superjolly, so here we go!
I'll try to post now and then about the progress, But first a little history.

I fell in love with a Superjolly Arca Camper some 17 years ago, when there was one on display only on the Mostra Scambio in Imola.  (Much later this one was sold to the Jansen family in Knegsel, Holland, only some 60 km's from where I live)

It now happened that one of the members of the Lancia Club knew of another Superjolly Arca Camper, which he accidently found on a vacation near Ventimiglia.  He even had a picture of it, and the owners telephone number.

Long story short, a few months later I found myself a very happy Hector in a van on the way to Belgium with an enourmous trailer carrying the Superjolly.

Due to other projects it was stored for quite a while, but the past few years I've worked on it every now and then.

I decided to remove the subframe, as after 30 years of standing I reckoned it needed a proper mechanical overhaul.
Only then I discovered some major play on the front wheel bearings, and found out this was an area where the previous owner already had tried to resolve some problems.
I also discovered that in fact only very little is shared with the Original flavia subframe, in fact this is limited to the bare subframe and the engine block. (even the aluminium castings carrying the suspention are different)
Everything else is superjolly specific, causing me a lot of trouble to locate spares.

In the meantime I redesigned the front bearing layout, as, for once, I was not happy with the Original design, which didn't seem to have lasted very long, since the car had only 77.000km on the clock.

Next will be the complete rebuitding of the engine and supension.

The bodywork is in fact in pretty good shape, only the complete lower 10cm of the cabin needed replacing.  The welding is now done, and all undercoating has now been removed from the cabin floor to allow for proper inspection/repainting.
For the rest all will stay as is initially, including the non-Original colour sceme (it was white-blue originaly just like the Jansen Arca camper, but the first owners had it repainted in the seventies 'per metterla piu moderna', which I wish they hadn't...)

The braking system had been partially removed before I bought the vehicle, and I now decided to use more modern (E-type racing 4x40mm ) calipers for the front, and rebuilt (with aluminium pots) Original spec calipers on the rear axle.
A new dual booster will be fitted resembling the Original system as much as possible.

Still hoping to locate new suspension ball joints by the time I get to re-assemble the subframe and suspension.

The fuel tank is another problem, I contained almost 10 kilo's of solids, and after I opened it up I decided It maybe better to make a new one in alumunium...

Attached some photo's:



* 115-1575_IMG.JPG (213.84 KB, 1024x768 - viewed 502 times.)

* 115-1590_IMG.JPG (210.15 KB, 1024x768 - viewed 971 times.)

* 115-1576_IMG.JPG (201.58 KB, 1024x768 - viewed 431 times.)

* 115-1580_IMG.JPG (230.07 KB, 1024x768 - viewed 472 times.)

* 115-1586_IMG.JPG (224.91 KB, 1024x768 - viewed 463 times.)

* 115-1587_IMG.JPG (232.86 KB, 1024x768 - viewed 456 times.)

* 115-1583_IMG.JPG (188.55 KB, 768x1024 - viewed 438 times.)
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Parisien
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« Reply #1 on: 15 March, 2014, 09:30:48 AM »

Dikappa, only seeing this thread now after you post on the Lancia vans, simply fabulous! Loving the almost home standard plumbed in Italian loo, surprised the cubicle isn't finished off in marble!!!

How have things progressed since? How many of these were made, or other info, got a link/photos to the Jansen van?

P
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Frank Gallagher
Dikappa
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« Reply #2 on: 16 March, 2014, 04:06:08 PM »

Hi Parisien,

Well there have been at least three, since there's one on a breaking yard not so far from rome.  I've been sending emails to ARCA (the company still exists) but heven't receives any reply, although on their website they have a 'history' section mentioning the Superjolly.
I guess there aren't many other survivers in good condition.

The work hasn't progressed much since the posting I must admit.  I have all the parts to re-assemble the engine now, and the heads are ready to mount.
I finisched the drawings for the revised front bearing layout, so have to contract the parts to be made.  It will be a reversable change, so no worries for the purists.
Since the Original boosters are missing I decided to use non-Original boosters, and the dual front calipers will be changed to four 40mm pot E-type calipers.  These will fit right on, again without any irreversible changes.

But now my first aim will be getting the furgone going, not decided if I will go for a full monty restauration immedeately, but want her running and braking in order to pass the Belgian oldtimer MOT and get her licenced as soon as possible.


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DavidLaver
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« Reply #3 on: 16 March, 2014, 09:03:09 PM »


Is that TWO four pot callipers per wheel or going to have "just" a single calliper?

David

PS - Anyone help me with "caliper" or "calliper"?   The spell check likes the second but my instinct is the first.
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David Laver, Lewisham.
fay66
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« Reply #4 on: 16 March, 2014, 10:48:13 PM »


Is that TWO four pot callipers per wheel or going to have "just" a single calliper?

David

PS - Anyone help me with "caliper" or "calliper"?   The spell check likes the second but my instinct is the first.

I'd go for the first as spellcheck is based on American English, just another example of the differences in our languages.

Brian
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Dikappa
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« Reply #5 on: 17 March, 2014, 05:54:50 PM »

Hi David,

No it would be one caliper (don't have a clue honestly if I'm writing this right, but then I'm belgian so maybe that excuses me?Huh?) per wheel since the steering arm won't allow for two, so it will be on the front mounting holes.
Still hoping to find a solution with two lines per caliper though, the ones I have now have only one.
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SanRemo78
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« Reply #6 on: 17 March, 2014, 07:05:15 PM »

Would Lancia Beta front callipers fit? They are twin circuit, twin lines?

Guy
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DavidLaver
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« Reply #7 on: 17 March, 2014, 07:34:43 PM »


I'm assuming the Super Jolly was Dunlop the same as the rest of the Flavia range?

This looks the sort of thing being discussed:

http://www.mandcwilkinson.com/parts/brake-upgrades/

David
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David Laver, Lewisham.
vigzag
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« Reply #8 on: 17 March, 2014, 08:53:27 PM »

Scan from Superjolly parts book showing original brake arrangement i.e. two callipers on each front wheel, one on each rear.

* superjollybrakes.pdf (1423.95 KB - downloaded 258 times.)
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1964 Flavia 1800 coupe
1966 Flavia 1800 convertible
1968 Flavia 1800 convertible
1964 Flavia 1800 Sport
1965 Flavia 1800 Sport
1966 Flavia 1800 Sport
1967 Flavia 1800 Sport
1974 2000HF
1966 Transit V4 van
Dikappa
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« Reply #9 on: 18 March, 2014, 07:22:16 AM »

@David

The link you posted shows exactly the calipers I bought for the superjolly.
I'm a big fan of originality, but in case of the superjolly brakes I would like it to stop too as we really intend to use it for our holidays (if the kids didn't already leave the house by the time I get it on the road......)

I know it should originally have two calipers on each wheel, but if you then take into account the left over free area for cooling of the discs, that leaves something to be concerned about.

I think thre Lancia engineers just had to confine themselves to what was available in the market at the time, which wasn't maybe the best solution, and the overly complicated braking system is known as one of the weak points of the design.

The other was the very time consuming and thus imo never very accurately performed adjustment of the preload on the front wheel bearings, which was done by shimming, (and required the complete re-disassembly and re-assembly of the complete hub as the shimms where inside), leaving my superjolly with damaged hubs and axles (luckily I found some replacements)
This I hope to improve so that preload can be adjusted from the outside.

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simonandjuliet
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« Reply #10 on: 18 March, 2014, 07:36:43 AM »

The original system does look complex - lots to go wrong !
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JohnMillham
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« Reply #11 on: 18 March, 2014, 08:36:47 AM »

These must be the most complicated brakes ever! They should be bullet proof.
Regards, John
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chriswgawne
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« Reply #12 on: 18 March, 2014, 10:45:24 AM »

Crikey, what a complicated original braking system -  with 2 servos? Will your new Jaguar based system also have 2 servos I wonder? What is No 9 0n the Superjolly diagram?
Chris
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Chris Gawne
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DavidLaver
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« Reply #13 on: 18 March, 2014, 10:59:59 AM »


Colin - I love that picture...

As for "originality" I understand the fear.  Beyond a couple of tins of paint all I've bought new for my project is one of the modern servos.  My hope is to use the original master cylinder and calipers.  If they don't come good there's lots of options there with sleeving, new old stock cylinders and any number of modern bolt on replacements. 

Complete new calipers are a new one on me - good to know.

David
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David Laver, Lewisham.
Dikappa
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« Reply #14 on: 18 March, 2014, 11:26:34 AM »

Chris, n 9 is the load dependent brake force limiter for the rear axle.  Is is connected to the leaf spring.  Another superjolly special as far as I know.

I intend to use a dual booster unit (aftermarket) it's in fact two boosters built together to one unit.  I got it new with some luck, and think it originates from the hot-rod scene......)

I've also been considering an electric-hydraulic brake booster, but thought that was a bit to far from the original design.
The original boosters were missing from the car, as was the master pump (A fulvia item was fitted but this has a much to small diameter), so I'll have to improvize a bit there.
The original master pump looks very alike a Flavia item but has a slightly larger diameter (I think it was 26mm) again a superjolly special!
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