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Author Topic: so, how was 2008 for Italy's marques?  (Read 2052 times)
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toby2449
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« on: 20 February, 2009, 04:28:43 PM »


well actually for Lancia & Fiat is wasn't that bad, for Alfa 2008 was a disaster!

Looking back over the decade of figures that i have, Lancia had their worst year since 2003, with total sales of 114,167.

As has been the case for many years now, Lancia's smallest model was its biggest seller, with the Ypsilon selling 61,655, nearly double its next best, the Musa @ 33,840, followed by Delta @ 14,005 & Phedra @ 4068. The gorgeous Thesis, which has never taken off, sold 583 examples.

So how does this generation of Lancia compare to their predcessors? Not that well!

Thesis has never reached the heights of the K, Thesis best year so far was 2003 when it sold 4,955, where as the K in 1997 & 1998 sold over 17,000 each year (before doing what all Italian vehicles do, & fall off dramatically!)

Ypsilon hasn't gotten anywhere near the Y, Ypsilon's best year was 2004 @ 88,015, the Y was 1998 @ 145,507!

However MPV's really seem to do well for Lancia, the current Phedra has sold 40k since its introduction in 2002, its best year coming in 2003, with 9,665, & the unsung hero of Lancia's range, the Musa has sold 146k since its introduction in 2004, however the main story around the Musa is it outsells the Fiat its based on, has done for 2007 & 2008 (2008 its sold twice as many!)

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Fiatís 2008 wasnít the flop it should have been given Italyís dramatic downturn, however there are some very worrying aspects to Fiatís figures!

As a whole Fiat sold 979,493 units in 08, their worst year since 2006 (934,256), its only when you look at the figures closely you see what Fiatís current problem is!

 Its called the Grande Punto! To put it mildly Fiatís money earner has flopped, sales in 2008 were 100,000 short of 2007! The old Punto regulary sold in excess of 500,000 each year, but the GP bottomed out at 286,935 in 2008, only 18k units more than the old Punto did in 2005 when it was due to be axed!

The Croma since its return in 2005 has sold 107,770 units, with 2008 being its second best year @ 28,065, the facelift seems to have worked (I happen to like the Croma!)

The 500 is Fiatís shining star, selling 178,076 units, & no doubt would have topped 200k had Italy stayed healthy!

Despite the arrival of the 500, Panda is still going strong (though its year on year increase has now stopped), sold 224,465.

Fiat predicted 120k units a year from the Bravo, & sadly that ainít going to happen, it sold 95,440 units in 08, which sadly means the Bravo will probably sell even worse than the Stilo did (its best yr 2002 with 154,017)

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And now to Alfa, oh dear where do I start!

Alfa was outsold in Europe by Lancia, something that hasnít happened since 1998, Alfa sold 102,635, the lowest since before 1997.

Apart from the MiTo (sold 13,296) thereís nothing for Alfa to be happy about.

The 147 is hemmeraging sales, in 2008 it sold 34,361 units (from a high of 92,459 in 2002) The 145 & 146 in their final full year sold more @ 49,292!

The 159 will go down as a disaster in terms of sales, 08 saw 42,536 units sold, & the 159ís high point came in 2007 when Alfa managed to shift 66,313, put this against the 156, & its best year was 2000 @ 97,826. Throughout the course of its life the 156 sold 700,222 units, the 159 was supposed to take sales from BMW, if anything the reverse happened, people just donít buy it!

However, the disaster of the 159 is nothing compared to the Brera & Spider its based on, both of which sell in woefully small numbers, the Brera @ 3,069, & Spider @ 2,537, how did Alfa get it so wrong!

Put the Brera & Spider together & you donít even get the same number as the GT which sold 6508, down however from 12,185 in 07!

And then theres the 166, which should have died quite some time ago, it sold 97 units in 2008, its best year was 1999 @ 26,537, basically the 166 had two good years during its life & then sales collapsed!
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fay66
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« Reply #1 on: 20 February, 2009, 08:00:53 PM »

I'm not surprised that the Grande Punto is not selling, perhaps the word has got around about water leaks into the tailgate, that Fiat seem determined to ignore by saying holes at the bottom of the tailgate inner skin are there to let water out! that may be the case if it's a couple of drips that have managed to find there way in, but certainly not what we, and many others appear to be experiencing see
http://www.fiatforum.com/grande-punto/92289-water-boot-lid-grande-punto-active-sport.html

and for what the problem looks like see
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cf0EP6ocC9Q

It's just like having your own built in waterfall, ours is now about to go in again for the 5th time to try to sort the problem. Dealer is currently trying to get a new tailgate out of Fiat but with no luck so far, they just want them to seal the tailgate surround, but I can't see that working; having worked in vehicle manufacture for 25 years it seems to me more like they have missed the weld sealer between to two main panels that make up the tailgate Angry

Looking on the Fiat Forum this has been on going since January 2007 and only one owner so far appears to have achieved a satisfactory cure. and we in ignorance picked ours up November 2007, next time I'll check the Forums first before getting any new car.

Apart from the fact that with the 1.3 Multijet it's gutless below about 1700 rpm when trying to pull out of a turning, it's a great little car spoiled by lack of detail and lousy back up from Fiat.

Brian
8227 Cry
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fensaddler
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« Reply #2 on: 22 February, 2009, 08:49:50 PM »

The 147's poor sales are no surprise - in a tough segment of the market its seriously old hat, and is running out just as a major recession hits.  Good car, especially secondhand, but needs replacing in the new car market.  Having just fallen big time for the 159, that's a shame - its a good car, and increasingly well priced now.  The MiTo, it seems, may not be quite as good as Italian car lovers think.  A road test in Autocar last week panned it for its ride and steering, placing it behind a Mini and a Fiesta (yes, I still know what I would choose...).  I've been underwhelmed by it in the showroom - there are elements of its interior finish which look positively cheap and tastless (the top of the gearknob, for one). So the 149 needs to be good.
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Chris Owen
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1987 Delta 1.3LX
2012 Skoda Yeti 112TSi 4WD
toby2449
Guest
« Reply #3 on: 23 February, 2009, 09:58:35 AM »


My wife owns a Grande Punto, its the 1.2 Active, & its much slower than her old 1.2 Punto HLX (with the 16v engine), however show it a back road & it flies! I never thought anything of the water coming from the tailgate when you open the hatch after it been raining, i've gotten soaked many a times!! ( i literally thought it was drainage!)

2009 looks to be better for Alfa (it really couldn't get worse!), Fiat are due to re-open the factory that build the MiTo early in order to resume production. have to say thought, everything i've read about the MiTo has been positive (apart from the steering, a common fault with all FGA vehicles its seems), getting 4 out of 5 in most respects
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Parisien
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« Reply #4 on: 11 April, 2013, 03:55:57 PM »

And what about the intervening years since....on the back of the Lancia lifeline thread??!!

P
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Frank Gallagher
fay66
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« Reply #5 on: 11 April, 2013, 11:09:04 PM »

And what about the intervening years since....on the back of the Lancia lifeline thread??!!

P

Ours went in 2009, by which time the tailgate glass and double skin had been sealed with lashings of black sealer which cured the leak but looked terrible, real bodge job.
The next phase was that the electric power steering threw a wobbly and I had to do an imitation of Mighty Joe Young to get it to do anything other than steer in a straight line, this meant another day at the dealers to have all the parameters reset, + the tracking checked, luckily ours was stlll under warranty, others on the Fiat Forum had to spend £100's replacing the steering.
A trip to Mons and back left me with a blister on my left hand due to the gearchange going very stiff and needing excessive force to change gear, not the happiest experience, it was eventually changed for a Citroen C3 Picasso, that after running for nearly 2 years, I have nothing but praise.

Brian
8227 Cool
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2006 Renault Megane 1 5 Dci Sports Tourer
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ncundy
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« Reply #6 on: 12 April, 2013, 09:06:28 AM »

You can access sale figures by manufacturer here:

http://www.acea.be/news/news_detail/new_vehicle_registrations_by_manufacturer/
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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
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