Lancia Motor Club

The purpose of this thread is really for me to share, vent and make pleas for help as I live with my '91 Dedra.

The car was recently bought from another LMC member and is a good solid and well-loved example of a Series 1 Dedra 2.0ie. Of course like any car that is approaching 20 years old it wears evidence of its mileage, some of this adding patina and some of this forming my rolling to-do list.

Already within a week I've benefited enormously from the collective knowledge of the LMC in beginning to repair and maintain my Dedra and I'll try to share in particular any unusual jobs as I tackle them, in the hope that fellow Dedristi might find them useful.

So here is the car:

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3051/2637837732_0ecfcf2c11.jpg)

J197GMM is a nice original car with no modifications, and not really likely to get any either unless they improve the dynamics of the car without compromising it's character and luxurious feel. At the time of writing 119,000 miles are showing on the odometer and this is believed to be genuine and correct.

I've tackled a few things already, as the car had a few quirks, issues and niggles:

*Car would not start and idle when cold without being nursed on the throttle *DONE - CLEANED ICV*
*Heater would not adjust between hot and cold *DIAGNOSED*
*Several dash and in-car illuminations not working *DONE - NEW BULBS AND SOME SOLDERING*
*Headrests would not adjust *DONE - ADJUSTED MOUNTINGS*
*Previous owner had removed speakers and head unit and so I needed to fit mine *DONE - FITTED*
*Rattles and squeaks from the dashboard area *IN PROGRESS - STRIP AND REASSEMBLE WITH GREASE AND FOAM PACKING AND REPLACE MISSING SCREWS*
*Wheels showing typical Dedra lacquer-lift *NEED WHEELS AND TYRES OR REFURB AND TYRES*
*Corrosion below fuel filler flap *NEED WING AND PAINT*
*Corrosion on OSF wing *NEED WING AND PAINT*
*OSR central locking motor inoperative *NEED NEW MOTOR*
*Electric aerial mast inoperative *NEED NEW AERIAL*
*Front tyres and spare will require replacement due to wear within 5000 miles or before MOT *SEE WHEELS*
*Rear discs and pads will require replacement due to corrosion and wear within 5000 miles or before MOT *NOT STARTED*

For a 17 year old Italian car, in fact scratch that... For *any* 17 year old car with over 118,000 miles on the clock I think that is a pretty minimal list of jobs... and rectification of all of these things will over time result in a really nice example of the marque. This is definitely a Dedra worth putting some time, effort and money into!

Time to get stuck in then...

After giving the car a good wash, wax, hoover and clean inside I felt more that it was mine, and wanted to admire it a little and then get my hands dirty with the repairs.

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1009/web.jpg)

Firstly I flipped the headrests out of the seats and aligned the mounting posts so that the headrests would adjust... resulting in aesthetically attractive headrest position and more comfort :)

I had found in the glovebox a few things that piqued my interest, I immediately refitted the glovebox lamp and lens... which made me happy (instant gratification always good... when something is in bits I often, with hope in my heat, reassemble to find out why it was taken apart... on this occasion simply putting it back together was all that was needed!), and I found a new LMC tax disc holder. After peeling off the Kwik Fit jobbie in the window and cleaning off the residual glue (fun!) I popped the LMC item on there and it looked neat from the outside and smart from the inside.

From this...

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_2889/web.jpg)

To this...

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1006.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155573660004)

I'd decided to fit plain plates to the car instead of the "Debra The Dedra" ones that the PO had on there. These were cleaned and stored, as I think they're part of the story of the car even if I'm not going to display them myself.

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1004.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155573000004)
(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1007.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155574020004)

I had an investigate of the electric aerial and it wasn't connected up, my little heart leapt... but even once the stereo was installed and the wires were connected up I was not able to coax it into life... one for another day. It receives stations perfectly (Radio 4) but doesn't retract... I'm sure that a "yoot" will snap it off so I've mentally filed a £39.00 sized request for a new one.

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1008.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155574280004)

The starting and idling problem was resolved by removing the idle control valve from the car, blowing it through with air and carb cleaner and then filling it with WD-40 and leaving it to soak in... another blow through with air and a further mist of WD-40 and it was ready to refit.

Advice and guidance from LMC and Lancisti members much appreciated, along with the fab Dutch chap that sent me through pdf wiring diagrams and a factory manual (admittedly in Italian... but helped me enough to suss out the Weber injection system and diagnose the issue).

Holy mother of god, it worked!!! :D

Moving along, I removed 5,000,000 screws and took apart the heater controls and reached the conclusion that I didn't have a clue what to do about that... replaced some bulbs, soldered some broken wires and re-assembled the dash (the drivers side vent is a sod to reassemble and route the wire so that it doesn't rub or restrict the vent flap mechanism... bloody Italians...).

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1016.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155570620003)

Some advice and extremely useful diagrams followed from Brian and I've now diagnosed a faulty heater control assembly... some more stripping and hopefully repair will remedy this, in the interim it's a hands and knees job to reach up and mix the hot/cold...  :-\

I've still got plenty to tackle... tonight has seen me stripping the front door to get the window switch out and discovering to my chagrin that the window switch illumination is not easily repaired (anyone know how to replace a bulb in this? Seems like a sealed unit???), so I moved to the back of the car...

I was able to diagnose that the wiring and power is intact on the OSR door and it's the central locking motor that has failed, whilst I was in there I replaced the bulb in the OSR and NSR ashtrays and the rear heater outlet... sadly it's the same story for illumination on the OSR window switch but I was chuffed to restore glow to the ashtrays and vent.

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_0263.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155578630002)

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_0264.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155578890002)

At this point in the evening I had a serendipitous moment as Steve (Steve Thompson, previous owner) called to say he'd dug out some Dedra spares from his garage and in there was a CL motor and a front window switch assembly! This is great and I'm looking forward to getting these (and some other spares for the shelf) and getting them on the car.

So after a wash and a leather down and a quick hoover and wipe down of my finger marks from the trim (latex glove dust... meh) it was time to hop in and go get some petrol and some odds and ends from Tesco... lovely to see the fully illuminated dash....

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_0265.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155579100002)

So that's it... first week with my Dedra and I've bonded with it already. Still missing my Prisma, but the refinement of the Dedra is ample compensation...

So long old friend  :'(

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100296/DSC00039_2.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12145013990001)

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100296/DSC00041_2/web.jpg)

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100296/DSC00004.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12145012020001)

Hi Ian,
Nice Car, nice write up,& she looks good.
Couple of points spring to mind after reading you're write up.

Do you have ABS? it would be nice to see an underbonnet shot.
When you come to doing the rear brakes you need the special tool that's not very expensive to buy, but the piston MUST be wound back, do not try to force the pistons back as you will do serious damage to the handbrake mechanism. :'(

With the door lock, take it apart and check that there isn't a broken wire inside, not uncommon.

Aerial- is it not working or just not moving?  these aerials are prone to sticking if dirty, they need a regular clean with WD40 and a light spray thereafter.
While you have the side carpet lifted to get at the aerial make sure the sunroof drain tubes go out through the floor, I was given a scrapper a few years ago, the boot floor was nearly detached from the rest of the car as it had been leaking water into the boot from the tubes both sides.

Window switches- you're right, you can't do anything with them.

Same thing applies with the lights & wiper switches on the steering column, they are fibre optics.

If at anytime the back seat rattles let me know & I'll tell you how to fix it.

If you get a warning light come up on the check panel which says you have a bulb gone at the front, but can't find it, let me know & I'll tell you how to find it.  (You don't expect me to give away all my hard earned secrets in one go do you ;D)

Finally if you send me a personal message or email with your address, I'll send you something you're sure to like ???

Photos are of my 2.0ie K452 PLK at Autoitalia Stanford Hall 2003, that year she won her Concours Class at the AGM, other photo is Diane & myself with "Fay" our Fulvia 2c Berlina, at La Mandria test track outside Turin at the 100th in 2006.

Brian
8227 8)

Do you have ABS? it would be nice to see an underbonnet shot.

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1119/web.jpg)

<not so clean as yours under there Brian  ;) >

<also curiously some induction pipes absent...>

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1122.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12155995080002)

When you come to doing the rear brakes you need the special tool that's not very expensive to buy, but the piston MUST be wound back, do not try to force the pistons back as you will do serious damage to the handbrake mechanism.

<aha, not unlike some Saab and Audi that I've worked on before (I try to keep it quiet but my first career was as a mechanic - I served a 3 year apprenticeship with Volkswagen Audi in the early 90's). Is it a hex key or a woodruff key arrangement or something unique?>

With the door lock, take it apart and check that there isn't a broken wire inside, not uncommon.

<would that be a broken wire inside the door or inside the central locking actuator itself, Brian? There is a delayed "click" from the actuator when I activate the central locking but no movement. On a side note my Prisma had lock/unlock buttons on the dash and I was surprised to find the Dedra has no such arrangement... unless I've overlooked something?>

Aerial- is it not working or just not moving?  these aerials are prone to sticking if dirty, they need a regular clean with WD40 and a light spray thereafter.
While you have the side carpet lifted to get at the aerial make sure the sunroof drain tubes go out through the floor, I was given a scrapper a few years ago, the boot floor was nearly detached from the rest of the car as it had been leaking water into the boot from the tubes both sides.

<I'm afraid the poor thing has expired. The mast was indeed stuck and I suspect that at some time it's eaten its own motor as a consequence... as a replacement is almost £40.00 I'm going to strip and examine the old one to find out if it can be repaired, otherwise I think it's going to require a nice new shiny one. Thanks for the tip about the sunroof drain tubes. I shall find them and give them a blow through with some air. Do you have a view on whether it is a good idea to squirt WD-40 down these or not? From a water displacement and protection view I think it's a good idea, but am worried that this might cause "clog" with dust etc sticking to the WD... what is the long term owner view? Frequent attentive cleaning or some kind of preservative?>

Window switches- you're right, you can't do anything with them.

<hey ho... one to swallow>

Same thing applies with the lights & wiper switches on the steering column, they are fibre optics.

<fortunately mine are working nicely at the moment. I hate to be beaten by stuff like this, the FO will have a light source which is probably an LED or capless bulb, just like the light switch... it'll just be the devil's own job to get in there without destroying the housing or the chances of invisible reassembly... might keep that in mind for when I get new switches, go for the "nothing left to lose" disassembly and investigate approach>

If at anytime the back seat rattles let me know & I'll tell you how to fix it.

< ;D I'm intrigued!>

If you get a warning light come up on the check panel which says you have a bulb gone at the front, but can't find it, let me know & I'll tell you how to find it.  (You don't expect me to give away all my hard earned secrets in one go do you )

< ditto ;) >

Finally if you send me a personal message or email with your address, I'll send you something you're sure to like

<I don't know the word that follows ditto... so ditto again... shall send you a PM, and really appreciate you kind support and advice>

Photos are of my 2.0ie K452 PLK at Autoitalia Stanford Hall 2003, that year she won her Concours Class at the AGM, other photo is Diane & myself with "Fay" our Fulvia 2c Berlina, at La Mandria test track outside Turin at the 100th in 2006.

<That's a lovely looking Dedra Brian, is it still in the club with her new owner? The Fulvia Berlina has been a long term fascination for me, how do they drive? I've been a 60's and 70's car man until quite recently (even ran a 50's car for a while) and a Lancia of this period would be wonderful. I have heard so much about how the pre-Fiat era Lancia over-engineered it's cars to the point of lunacy... the trip meter knob on a Fulvia coupe springs readily to mind as an example. The Berlina looks to my eye more unusual than the coupe and has the same appeal as a late 60's Giulia Super, but with added Lancicity... shall look forward to seeing Fay in the metal :)>

Brian
8227

Higher resolution versions of all images on the thread may be found at:

http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary#100319&bgcolor=black&view=grid

Hi Ian,

That's weird? when I looked at this the other day I could see your underbonnet photos, these now seem to have disappeared :o

"Now young Hilton write out 100 times, I musn't try to teach my Grandmother to suck eggs"  :-[

I wasn't aware of your technical qualifications at the time, so as I always assume that most peoples knowledge is of a more basic nature when advising, sorry.

Tool to rewind pistons in rear calipers, vague recollection that it fits into a slot in the piston.

Broken wire /connection- in the lock itself.

Lock/Unlock button- there isn't one, however  with front doors closed pushing down either button will lock both front doors, pulling the front door release lever will unlock both, back doors lock independently.

Sunroof drain tubes- never found it necessary to spray with anything, if you are going to get a blocked drain tube it will be the front ones ( usually announced by gurgling noises) so a blast of air down them won't go amiss, rear ones -just ensure they protrude right out through the boot floor.
Never actually had a front drain tube leak but the rubber hose each side is connected to a stub on the sunroof frame & held with a clip or plastic tie, so it's worth a look if you ever have to drop the front end of the headling panel.

Lights & Wiper switches fibre optic light source - "Your a betta man than I am Gunga Din"

Back seat Rattle cure & bulb blown :-X- ???

K 452 PLk- I sold her in 2004, previously I had spent a fortune on body & paint, and with Dentmaster (Money well spent), after about 2 years she was up for sale again at Brooklands AutoItalia Spring Italian Car Day, & I was very seriously thinking of buying her back, but in the meantime she had changed hands, had been badly keyed down the full length of the car both sides, and a Lancia specialist!!! in doing a small weld repair underneath, didn't remove the back seat and managed to set it on fire which necessitated another rear seat.
Just couldn't face all that work.
The next owner kept her very nice and only parted with her end of last year. I don't know who the present owner is.

My 2c isn't the fastest thing on 4 wheels from a standing start but once up to speed is great & is always a pleasure to drive, we drove her to Portugal & back in 2004 3500miles, much of which was covered at 70 or 70+ mph. We ran from Salamanca to Pamplona & then over the Pyrenees to St Jean Pied d Port in one day (have a look on a map & see just how far that is), most of it in 90f heat, it was so hot that I had to turn my side visor around to the side so I didn't get a sunburned ear ;D 
Most days we averaged 300+ up to 400 miles a day, the 3500 miles was coverd in just 10 days of actual driving + a couple of days running around locally in Portugal, bearing in mind that also covers a Dover to Boulogne & a Boulogne to Dover ferry crossing.
Ride is fantastic, very supple and generally I can go over speed humps or rough roads faster than I can in a modern car.

Fulvia series 1 Berlinas were the first of the Genre and are massively over engineered when you get to see "Fay" have a good look around, the column gearchange mechanism under the bonnet is a typical example, all being totally adjustable. Don't forget to look at my speedo, it's a drum that rotates past a fixed needle :o

Question ??? Have you found the emergency winder key for the electric sunroof yet ??? Do you have one ???

2 photos of "Fay" at speed 3 up, at La Mandria Fiat/Lancia Test Track Turin 2006.

Brian 8227 8)

The photo's should be back now, Apple had some kind of launch for a portable telephone or something and it all went pear-shaped :p

Can't fault your approach Brian, for every one thing I know about cars I bet there are ten subtly unique things about Lancia cars that I don't know, and you simply cannot beat the wisdom of experience... given the choice between first hand tips from a long term owner or textbook knowledge, I'll take the friendly advice thank you :-)

I've got some time this weekend to play with the car so I'm going to give this lock a good check over, that said I'm also heading over to Grimsby to pick up some bits from Steve, possibly including some lock parts.

This rattle and bulb thing still has me thinking... my mind is leading me towards strut top mounts but I suspect I'm barking up the wrong tree, fortunately mine is OK in that respect... for now :)

Sad story about K 452 PLK, I guess especially if you've known a car during a time when it was really looking splendid then it's got to be sad to see it deteriorate. After my Dad sold his Dedra we saw it locally and the electric aerial had been replaced with one of those rubber truncheon jobs and the wheels had inexplicably been painted a kind of gold/copper colour... which looked dreadful on a Caribbean Blue car. I'm petrified of having GMM damaged whilst out, my Prisma was keyed last year in London and I was just so incredibly angry and upset about it... it was the pointlessness of it, if I'd been badly parked it would not have excused the situation but I can understand that especially non-drivers become enraged by inconsiderate parking... but I could think of no reason why someone would target the Prisma, because the car was old, conspicuously shiny and well cared for I can't fathom what the motivation was... even the least petrol headed anarchic street reclaimer would not have mistaken my well-loved £450 Prisma for a £70,000 Mercedes. I hate to leave the Dedra anywhere I can't see her... which I'm hoping I'll calm down on, as it makes using the car as a daily a bit nerve wracking :-(

My friend that I was staying with suggested that it might have been an Audi rallyfan with a very long memory ;)

I'm really looking forward to seeing Fay, the pictures are great and she looks like a hoot to drive. As I alluded to, my heart belongs to older cars and something like your Fulvia ticks all of the boxes, if I'm allowed to pore over her for a while then I'll be very pleased to do so, I imagine that the next thing we'll get along to will be the Auto Italia day in September, will you be there in Fay? :-)

Moving along to matters Dedra, a new pair of horns arrived yesterday courtesy of eBay, I'm going to fit these this afternoon. They're integrale spec, so they are original Lancia parts but with a more sporty (and to my mind more Italian) tone than the rather weedy "poot" of the single horn that's on there at the moment... on my old 1969 Cooper I stole directly an idea from a 60's Flaminia which was to fit dual-tone horns and wire the headlamp flash into the horn circuit so that a stern blast was punctuated by a flash of the lamps... the general mini-mafia ambience of the black Dedra makes me hanker for this again, but I'm not sure what the MOT regulations would have to say about that... was a fun trick though, and I doff my cap to the Flaminia for pulling it off with aplomb. Dedra modifying is proving a costly business however, and these HF horns have set me back no less than 99p plus shipping (£3.00)... barely used though, so I shouldn't gripe :-D

Hmmmm "barely used" = corroded and with broken off terminals.

Have soldered and cleaned them back up to a satisfactory standard, but not impressed with the seller, a known Lancia breaker on eBay that is selling up...

Still a cheap fix, but not as described!

Hi Ian,
Envelope should be wingings it way to you if I can get to the post office in the next 20 minutes(unlikely) or monday morning.

Pretty sure Steve's a Current/Ex Mechanic possibly with Fiat/Lancia, but I maybe wrong ???

The induction pipes need sorting! have you still got the plastic box that the pipe fits into which is immediately behind the hood rail & lock?
Wish you'd said before as my last bit went to someone at the AGM, it's one bit that always goes tatty but costs over £30 for the part new, & secondhand would be no good.

Must put you out of you misery regarding rattle & bulb, if you operate the catch to to rear seat, pull it slightly forward on the edge facing you should see a little triangular rubber buffer, if you can only see a metal pin with a rolled over edge, it's missing-hence rattles :D
If you have a front bulb out, warning light, turn ignition key to the accessory position, this should light the parking lights but when you have ordinary lighting on you can't see this unless you know what you are looking for,  it's right at the bottom of the lamp asm and isn't as bright as the sidelamp bulbs. ;) There go the secrets!

I know what I'd like to do with the toe rags who vandalise cars, they don't appear to have brains, just an envy of what someone else has, and most would probably never think of earning money to buy one themselves.

Just use your Dedra and hope they leave it alone, if you don't they win anyway.

Not sure about Gaydon yet but she will be a The Classic Silverstone on Saturday the 26th, 2 weeks from today.

Also at Classics on the Common at Harpenden Hertfordshire on the 30th July.
 Whenever we meet you will be quite welcome to given her a good look over, and probably get a ride.

If you had a weedy horn note from your Dedra one of them wasn't working, all Dedra have twin windtone type horns behind the grille, but because they are on the receiving end of any wet coming through the front they or the wiring gets corroded, much better horns than on my mercedes, in fact I have a pair of Dedra Horns waiting to go on it.
Mind, I like the flash the lights trick with the horns.

Thank God for ebay!!! I've bought quite a few new old stock bits for "Fay" from all over, Germany Austria & even the USA.

Brian
8227 8)
 

Ooh, shall be watching the postie with interest then :D Shall suss out the Classic and see if we're free to attend, I have some work travel coming up so might conflict though : :-\

I asked Steve about the pipework but he doesn't think that he still has it, having had a look at your engine bay pictures Brian I can see I'm missing the connector with the airbox, the latitudinal section and whatever trumpet / filter arrangement is at the end of that section, oh and clips. One to hunt down :)

But to the real juice of today's posting (other than my horn exploits)... booty!

Reading matter (thanks Alan!):

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1141.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12158896260002)
(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1142.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12158896540002)

I have both volumes of the factory workshop manual there, all complete and in good condition, and a very girlfriend-unfriendly stack of Viva Lancia, News Sheet and Lancia Motor Club Journal (oldest edition predates me by one year!  :o ). The manual will be treasured as these factory books are just the BEST, but I would be willing to conditionally loan these to Dedra owners locally and to scan / mail copies of sections for Dedristi further afield... the information here is detailed, methods are included, and all data is factory correct. Am happy to spread the love here, same goes for my Prisma and Pre-63 Volkswagen factory manuals... would far rather see this data going to good use than gathering dust! :)

Parts haul (thanks Steve!):

(http://gallery.mac.com/ian.cleary/100319/IMG_1146.jpg?derivative=medium&source=web.jpg&type=medium&ver=12158896820002)

Steve showed me a bunch of this stuff as we were chatting but I have window switches, central locking parts, door locks, door motors, wiper motor, pair used headlamps, one NOS headlamp, a NOS trailing arm, hoses, dash parts, wiper and light switches, all drop glass, rear lamps, indicator lenses and god knows what else.  8)

As we were driving over to Grimsby I asked my Dad to listen out for the rattle in the n/s footwell to try and diagnose this... it turned out to be the panel that the sunroof key clips into that was rattling, so my patented "grease, pack and refit" solution for squeaking and rattling Lanteriors was applied and now the car is pretty much quiet inside other than some road noise that I think some appropriate rubber will eradicate (as I'm a low mileage chap I'm going to fit some soft compound rubber on the car for noise and handling advantages.

With the magazines I'm going to read through them and then if anyone would be interested to take a turn and pass them on when read then I'll be more pleased to pass them along than hoard them, and SWMBO will kill me if I don't ;)

Pretty good day all in all :-)

Hi Ian,
Didn't he do well, as Bruce Forsyth used to say ;D
If the 2nd manual is the electrical one complete with the diagnostics & fault finding, I wouldn't mind a copy, mine is a photo copy of what the club library held about 15 years ago.
It was only last year that someone kindly gave me a genuine workshop manual, but only book one, the CD is the first in English that Terry Pritchard kindly scanned for me and put on CD, prior to that the only CD that I could copy and send to owners in Europe was in German ::)

I shall have to spoil the surprise now as it's the Dedra manuals that I hold + various other bits I've collected/ bought over the same period to help do my (Self imposed job) of Dedra Adviser. Now it seems probably no longer needed.

It's sounding like I've a good idea who might be in line for the Dedra Advisers job when I give it up, better technical qualifications & better information than when I started ;D

Looks like you had an extremely worthwhile visit to Steve & the spares you've acquired are well worth having.

The sunroof key always did rattle, I'm not surprised considering the weight of it & where it's situated.

Not wishing to put you off but be a bit circumspect if you decide to loan your manuals out, I once did this about ten years ago thinking to help someone out, only to find shortly after that two copies of my manual where on sale in ebay, considering that I loaned them for free and had originally cost me £85 from the LMC Library back in 1993, I was not best pleased. >:(

Shown is the air intake that I mentioned last time, 2 screws hold it to the hood rail the a hose that is rubber covered (for intake noise insulation?) goes to the airbox.

Brian
8227 8)

Ps. Hope you can make Silverstone

Yes, am very pleased with the haul ;D

Indeed the second manual is the electrical one, and I'll be pleased for you to have a copy of this, perhaps also handy to keep in the central repository, I'll PM you to find out what parts you need. We'll have to have a chat about the copyright arrangements between LMC and Lancia on the copy and distribution of their manuals.

If it makes sense and doesn't put the club at risk of exposure to copyright infringement then I'll be pleased to keep these stored on a (secured) server where those in the know can get at them. I saw that reproductions are selling on eBay for £99.00 so I'm guessing that a balance needs to be struck between sharing in the spirit of co-operation and asking for bother ;)

As for the CD, I simply cannot say how handy electronic documentation is these days! I'm sure you've picked some seriously helpful stuff in your club role and I think that there's a lot more to this expert malarkey than meets the eye, I'll be pleased to receive all Dedra-related information, and in e-format it even means I can dip into it on my laptop while pondering problems on my car instead of working :D

Got lots to learn about Dedra's yet and I think it'll be some time before I'm up to a helpful level, but I'll keep documenting my exploits with Debra (the name has stuck, my daughter refers to Dedra as Debra, so Debra it remains :D ) and hopefully some of the things that are tackled will be useful to others.

In recent years I've got very lazy when working on cars and anything with more than two wires, pipes or clips gets photographed before being disassembled or adjusted and this speeds up the process in both directions, less need for extensive labeling and less chance of messing up reassembly - it's amazing how especially with wiring the repairs of previous owners and mechanics, often replacing wires with non-standard colours can be confusing when trying to match the car with the manual... the point of mentioning this is that if I mention a job I've done on the car then there are usually strip and rebuild photos to support the work. I keep these and usually pass them on a CD to the next owner... if it's helpful to anyone then I can post these for most jobs that I mention here.

I'll keep in mind your comments about the manuals, bearing in mind my comments about copying and legal above I'd rather keep on the right side of Lancia on this one. And of course once I've got scans of the 2nd manual (that sounds like an exciting job for a Sunday) that will compliment those of yours, Brian, of the first volume then the club should have the ability to help anyone needing hard or soft copies of the data.

Operation air intake is now commenced, anyone hearing of the needed bits should give me a yell :D

Looking forward to tomorrow night, I'll get a chance to sift through the parts and see what I have and what I'll be able to fit immediately to improve areas of the car.

Time for bed then!

:D

We'll be looking at what we can and can't scan and distribute as part of the "digital archive" project, but if you find out anything concrete in the meantime, please share!

Well, I've not gotten bored and given up posting but have had a busy week this week. I've had a new roof put on the garage, so the Dedra now can remain dry even in the nastiest weather  ;D

Minor horror as I parked the Dedra on the drive while the men were replacing the felt on my roof and I specifically asked them to shout me when they were starting the messy stuff so I could get the car out of the way. After unrolling the felt I saw one of the labourers approaching my car with a rag to brush off the sand and bitumen that had blown onto my paint...   :o

I practically leapt through the window and after a few choice words I parked the car on the street until they had finished... spent a good few hours carefully cleaning the paintwork afterwards and I'm relieved to report no damage was sustained... anyway, seeing as how I was already on with it I gave her a thorough valet and tried out some of the interior plastic cleaner from Auto Glym that was sitting on my shelf. Am very pleased with the results on the dash and door trims, it's good stuff that doesn't leave a shine but rather restores the lustre to the plastic and cleans back to a "factory" finish. Motivated by this I applied some exterior bumper cleaner on all external black plastics and then finished off with a coat of black Colour Magic on the body to leave it gleaming and glossy.

I know that regular polishes are rather looked down upon by the hardcore detailing fiends but I must say that both on my red VW Scirocco and my current black Dedra I've found Colour Magic to deliver pretty good results... it just needs a bit of elbow grease. I see that T-cut are pushing a "scratch repair" colour matched paste now and so I might give that a go with the power mop at some stage... for now though Dedra is drawing positive comments and I'm having to pop into the garage every 15 mins or so to check how nicely she's shining  ;D

After that little lot I checked the levels and did some underbonnet cleaning and fettling, topped the oil up and noted that the PAS level was down about an inch... the pump is noisy at start-up from cold so I'm going to get some PAS fluid for a top-up and see how it goes... haven't left myself entirely unbraced for a new pump and there's a NOS one rattling round on eBay that I'm going to try and score if it's still available after payday.

The car does use a bit of oil and over the @ 700 miles I've done in it so far it's burned about 0.5l, I say burned because when I floor it from cold I get a bit of a blue "poof" from the rear... I'm imagining it's either rings or bore wear, going by the 118k mileage. I'm not driving the car hard at the moment, partly because of the price of "sans plomb" but also because it's my intention to bring this engine to full health, I should be able to find a quiet 15 mins and whip the head off to have a look at the bores... might try a few of my fishwives remedies (  ;) ) first just in case the rings are gunked up and it's not actually caused by wear...

I'm going away for a few days soon and shall drop some diesel down the plug-holes before I go... that should give the rings a chance to sort themselves out if that's what it is... for 118k on a 17 year old car I've got to assume it's either had quite an easy life or if it did fleet service at the beginning of its life (really have no idea yet) and rattled off @ 50k in the first 3 years then perhaps the last 15 or so years have been spent in a very relaxing manner... I'm quite keen to sort it though, and to exploit the performance of the 2.0 Lampredi motor where I can. It's a lovely smooth engine and even though it doesn't sound quite as mischievous as the Prisma it's an enjoyable noise :)

Having previously overlooked Dedra as being a bit pipe and trilby in comparison to earlier Lancias I'm finding that I really have bonded with this car, and am idly thinking... hmmmm stationwagon to replace the Laguna... perhaps worth keeping my eye out for a tidy turbo... think I've been hooked by this dull and unworthy, unremarkable and staid badge-engineered Fiat ;-)

 "think I've been hooked by this dull and unworthy, unremarkable and staid badge-engineered Fiat ";-)

 :o :o :o Ian, go and wash your mouth out with carbolic soap at once ;D

0.5l of oil isn't bad at all, Pebbly Beach told me when I bought my first Dedra back in 1992 that it wasn't uncommon for them to use a drop of oil as they were "designed to do that" nonetheless it used to do about 1500miles to the pint until I blew a head Gasket at about 118K, after that it never did more than a 1000 miles to a pint of oil, so unless your really sure it's necessary I'd be inclined to leave it with the head intact, I also used semi-synthetic with a can of Wynns at every oil change.
It was the only one of mine that ever had the head off, and was still going strong when I sold her at 150k, only problem was the fella I sold her to (who worked for me) thought it a good idea to cut a bit off the coil springs & completey knackered the electronic shockers in very short order, which up to then had been fine.

I winced at the thought of someone wiping sand off your paint with a cloth :'(

Like yourself, these days I always use colour magic with a major clean and in between a Meguires spray wipe on wipe off polish.

The power steering pump just probably needs topping up, I can't remember anyone changing one, they sometimes get a bit noisy on full lock if the belt is a bit loose though.

Brian
8227 8)

Thanks for that Brian, that's reassuring stuff. You'd mentioned previously about the "designed to use oil" aspect of the Lampredi engine, and now I've got a few miles under my belt with her I've got the yardstick I guess. If I get to more than 1ml per mile then I'll look into it but in other aspects the engine purrs nicely, runs well and there are no untoward knocks or rattles at this time. I shall monitor things but otherwise let her be. With the PAS noise, I'll look at the adjustment on the belt, that's a good thought, shall check with the technical data and get it within tolerances for oil and tension and see how it is then... it's noticably quieter when it's warmed up.

LOL @ the reprimand for my Fiat-slurring... I've been re-reading the contemporary roadtests and LMC publications  ;D

Having driven a few Tipos when they were newish I actually quite like them, in particular I thought that the 1.4 was quite nippy and a lot of car for the money, and the 16v was a monster. The Dedra / Tipo / Tempra floorpan is clearly a good 'un and I enjoy driving the Dedra immensely.

Question for the buffers amongst you: Is it possible to provide Lancia with my chassis number and obtain (at cost I imagine) a certificate of build, showing the cars OE specification and any options added at the time of build (excluding dealer fit, naturally)?

Might hunt down some of the Meguires that you mention, Brian. Is it one of these that you "don't need to wash" before applying? I'm a bit wary of those... I'd prefer something to apply after a wash, leather and a few hours drying time.

Question for the buffers amongst you: Is it possible to provide Lancia with my chassis number and obtain (at cost I imagine) a certificate of build, showing the cars OE specification and any options added at the time of build (excluding dealer fit, naturally)?
Hi Ian, Would suggest Fiat Uk is the best place to try, Tim Speechley     tim.speechley@fiat.com  He's a pretty busy man & he might not thank me, but I'm sure he can point you in the right direction assuming that information is available

Might hunt down some of the Meguires that you mention, Brian. Is it one of these that you "don't need to wash" before applying? I'm a bit wary of those... I'd prefer something to apply after a wash, leather and a few hours drying time.

When I get "Fay" out on friday ready for Silverstone Classics, I'll have a look and tell you exactly what the name is, & it is an apply after washing

Brian
8227 8)

Cheers Brian :)

Big day tomorrow as it's the first long run in the Dedra, am down in London with work for the next couple of days. Fortunately I have an underground carpark that I use... currently housing this:

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3017/2711193945_0d7391b225.jpg)

Shall see if I can get a shot of the Dedra and it's Germa... *cough* Italian cousin together  ;)

Fingers crossed, some of the parts I've been hunting should start arriving this week... starting with a stock of NOS Lancia filters and belts  :D

Wish me luck on my adventure, gave her a check over and a quick wash tonight and changed the n/s headlight bulb (dash check didn't pick that one up).

Hi Ian,
Good Luck ;D
You may see I've made mention of a lot of Dedra HF turbo bits on ebay, A friend has just told me that the seats (in blueish grey alcantara) are Recaro's and as scarces as the proverbial rocking horse doo do. :D
Well worth a look if the colour will go, he is also selling a original fit leather steering wheel, I had one on K452 PLk, and it was lovely.

Brian
8227 8)

Well, a work trip scuppered quite a few of my plans for eBay hauling the last week or so, and am exhausted! :(

I lost a few auctions, had to take some further drives and identified a few more challenges to work through on the car:

1) Steering pump: becoming really noisy, I've replaced the fluid with Slick50 PAS fluid and it's calmed things down a bit but a new pump needs to be sourced
2) N/S/R wheel bearing: has become noisy, had a flip through the manual and looks like the bearing is part of the hub and not available separately... hmmm, great design there Lancia  ???
3) Front end clunk: I'm thinking that this is either a track-rod-end or a ball-joint, it's not pronounced but I'm noticing it when turning at a halt or when on cobbles / speed humps. It's not a top-mount, different noise.

So looks like I need to plunk down for TDC membership and get some parts ordered and fitted, all good fun stuff and should keep the car driving nicely  :)

Been another busy week and have put another 500 motorway miles on the Dedra as a result  :o

1) I've swapped out the PAS pump and it's now purring like a kitten... yay!!
2) My screenwash ran low and the checklight came on, I filled it up and the checklight stayed on... not so yay (any quick tips from the Dedristi before I grab the manual and my testlight?)
3) Wheel bearing really noisy now... cannot tune it out and so need to get that sorted pretty quickly
4) Thanks Alan for the mail about the clunk... looks like a pattern part is fitted there but there's also some play in the n/s trackrod end
5) ICV causing the cold idle to play up again, need to get it off and clean it out. Been almost 2000 miles since I did it which doesn't seem very long... shall have to try some gentle solvent in there to clean it all out.
6) Front tyres are a bit long in the tooth, if I'm going to be buying two tyres then I should consider carefully what I'm doing about wheels and either get mine reconditioned at the same time or if I'm going to change wheels then sort myself out and get the timing right on wheels and tyres.

Been an expensive month (thanks TFL for the congestion charge penalties... that helped  :'( ) so I've not got the free cash to grab parts until the end of August now, so shall be trying to keep the miles down until then.

Hi Ian,
Glad the power steering pump is now purring.

Windscreen wash warning light, gently prise the sender out of the washer tank and clean up, as I recall it's it has a float around the central core which tends to get gunged up with the screen additive residue, & while you're at it clean the terminals, with a bit of luck that should fix it.

Rear Wheel Bearings only available from Fiat/Lancia as the complete Hub & Bearing although both sides use the same hub, however if you do go this route check first if you have ABS, if so you require 46425959 (£132.49 list 2005). or non ABS 51754192 (£50.45 List 2005).
however if you go onto ebay europe enter item 230279677965 then go to the sellers shop, once in there in the search put Lancia, you will find that they will supply Hub Asms with or without phonic rings, single bearing kits, or a kit with 2 of everything you need at very reasonable prices.

Idle Control Valve, the clean out you did doesn't seem to have lasted long! I usually leave it upside down to soak overnight, filled with WD40, Plus Gas or your favourite cleaner, a good work out of the centre valve against it's (strong) spring, then another flush out usually works, if this doesn't work then I think you're in the market for a replacement; I have read elsewhere, but I can't remember where, that you can take it completely apart to clean, as this involves a strong spring & visions of it shooting off behind the workbench somewhere never to be found, & making sure everything lines back up the way it was, I'd sooner not :o

Dedra's always look best on OEM Wheels, although you can go to 195x15 tyres & 15" wheels as fitted to Dedra Turbo, I was always unhappy at the coarse ride these gave, compared to the excellent ride on standard 14" Dedra Alloys.

Sounds like you need a set of Dutch Number plates ;D

Brian
8227 8)

LOL, it's Polish plates round here Brian... ;D

Took your advice on the screenwash sender, and somehow it removed the warning lamp... YAY! (I've even drained the screenwash reservoir to see if it came on when empty and went off as I filled it - yup!). Option 2 would have been to disconnect it, but nice to have these things working. I always feel like letting something like this fall out of use is the thin end of the wedge when it comes to maintainence

Again, the wheel bearings... had a look on the eBay links and looks very reasonable. I'm assuming that these are decent quality parts and the vendor is good? Do you have experience with this seller?

With the ICV I think I'm going to try some PlusGas in there, but also got a very interesting mail from Alan about possible causes (crankcase breathing sounding a very plausible cause...). In the longer term I shall look into the breather filter and Delta HPE ICV possibilities he mentioned - another mine of information on Dedra, Alan certainly knows his onions and his knowledge of my actual car is pretty handy too :)

Wheels... yes.... well in a case of ambition outpacing spending power I dropped into Zagato a couple of weeks back and was looking at refurb wheels... they can do either 14" Dedra, 15" Dedra Turbo or 15" Delta HPE (they might have been 16"... but they were smaller than the Evo rims next to them) at quite reasonable prices. I've not found anything aftermarket that I'd feel truly happy with, am just a bit too skint right now.

On a tangent though... I've noticed how there is an eerie similarity between my Dedra and the styling of the current Honda Accord. I know that the Accord name is not that exciting but (shoot me if you like) I've always thought that this generation is quite a handsome car... and it's a bit Dedra-ish to boot. Now, the Accord has a style of wheel that is a very plain, very flat anthracite 5 spoke and I think they'd look great on a Dedra, especially if a few mm was shaved from the ride height (this is daydreaming territory... my wallet just imploded at the thought of a full suspension overhaul and some Ohlins for each corner  ;) )

(http://www.testdriven.co.uk/photos/3zG5jO5A.jpg)

(http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb200/grimwau/606%20KPO/echo2.jpg)

I've always found the "face" of the Accord a bit Lancia-like  ;)

(http://www.whatcar.com/Car/Honda/AccordTourer/864423743.jpg)

Hi Ian,

Polish plates even better but I don't have any of those but Dutch plates !!!!
And another little irritation bites the dust, pleased the warning lamp now works as it should.

Re ATP-Autoteile, I have no personal experience of them but I've been checking them on ebay, they have a 99.5% feedback rating for the last twelve months, in that time they've sold over 90k items. they give a 2 year warranty on parts.
Admitted they have had quite a few neutral feedback, getting on for 400, and a handful of negatives; quite often the neutral feedback is due to shipping times, not what the buyer thought he'd bought etc, the Negative ones are obviously the more important but looking through about 30 pages of feedback I only found one, and this appeared to be that a damaged part had been received and not sorted out properly.
Taken in the context of the 90k sales, the neutral & Negative reports are not bad.
I note he's been selling on ebay for 9 yrears so he's well established.
bottom line is I'd be happy to deal with them.

As I've said before Alan & Steve are both well up on Dedra as well as other Lancia.

I often though about fitting Delta Hpe wheels as they are a nice looking wheel, also much easier to keep clean & they don't corrode like Dedra Alloys, I think Lancia have learnt the lesson regarding polished alloys. Don;t know if I'sve said so before but the Anthracite wheels from the Ypsilon Elefantino Rosso look good on Dedra, tried on once off of my Rosso on one of the Dedra's and it looked good.

See what you mean about the Accord! I like the wheels but I think they show too much of the brakes for my liking.


Brian
8227 8)

erm what do ya recon to my wheels 16" delta hpe rims with 195 45 16 , nice ride on koni dampers with standard springs, fill the arches but don't fowel even with 5 adults in (looked cool rediculasly low with 5 in it ;D)

Drool!!!! They look lovely James!

BTW: sorry about having not been in touch, work and then holidays have been bonkers. However I'm still really keen to get some of those bits from you, so if it's OK to give you a call and sort this out then please let me know :-)

And yours looks like my favourite colour... met bordeaux?

ROSSO SPEED .......appropriate ;D very similar to winner red, anytime that suites you

The tool for the rear calipers locates in a slot in the piston and reacts against the caliper body. You can then wind in the piston and push it at the same time. Halfords sells them for around £10-20 I think. I do not know where abouts you are or I would offer to lend you mine.

Was sooooooo sad. The wheel bearing didn't arrive in time so we had to go Auto Italia in the Laguna while Dedra sat alone in the garage...  :'(

Had a great day though and am looking forward to getting her back on the road this week and with some fresh rubber under the arches. There was no auto jumble at Auto Italia, which was a mild disappointment... but there was a lovely burgundy (speed red?) turbo for sale... mmmmm

Ian

I think that's probably my biggest gripe about all the Auto Italia events, there are often very few commercial stands that actually sell anything useful (Brooklands probably has the best range).

A couple of years ago there was a small 'Italian market', then last year nothing, which was a step backwards in my opinion.   Didn't go this year as cost was a factor (£25 to get my family in to a museum I've been to twice already and changes very little)

Not sure how busy it was - but hopefully the weather meant there was lots of nice stuff there.

Duncan

Yep, bit more autojumble please. I'm a dedicated rummager :D

Lin pulled up and applied the handbrake on her Dedra 2.0ie. It went clunck and the lever lost its control over things. Could it be the cable?

Peter... that sounds like the first line of a Barbara Cartland novel...  ;D

Starting at the lever, is the button sprung as normal and operating the ratchet on the lever?
Does the lever feel like it builds resistance as you pull it?
With the car rolling gently, pull on the lever... does the car brake at all (rear end sinking)?

/ic

Pulling the lever right up it does just hold the car. Cant say anymore until Wednesday as I have to take Barbara's dog for a walk. Will report back and btw, thanks in advance.

Surrealism is alive and well on this forum.  Peter - that is the most bizarre comment I have read on here in a long time.  You've really cheered me up.  LOL!!

Peter,
If you try to pull away with the handbrake on does it seems to hold more on one side? There are 2 cables  & if so it sounds like the cable to the other side isn't holding , but, it might be the handbrake side of the caliper so try the cables first.

Below are diagrams & photos of the rear brakes from the manual & parts list.
Brian
8227 8)

Thanks Brian you are right, one cable has gone awol. have now spoken to Neil at Pershore who reckons, for the price its best to change both, will keep you up to date. Glad I cheered our Chris up, he has looked a bit peaky lately.

LOL (again)  ;D