Lancia Motor Club

Well my issue of the latest Automotive News Europe came through my door recently & it has the Data Book for 2007!.

In Europe 2007.............N. America..............Japan.......China..........India........Aus.......Argentina........Brazil
Alfa = 145,373..........................0..............3,844..........n/a............n/a.........n/a..............n/a...........n/a
Fiat = 1,012,404..................3,300..............1,750......36,610.........2,279.....4,552..........56,950.....615,001
Ferrari 2,954.......................1,883.................412.........n/a............n/a.........n/a..............n/a............n/a
Lancia = 122,150.......................0.................115.........n/a............n/a.........n/a..............n/a............n/a
Maserati = 2,904.................2,653.................463.........n/a............n/a..........n/a..............n/a...........n/a

The figs for China - Brazil aren't broken down to brands

And how surprising that in North America Fiat sold 3300, made up of...
605 Grande Punto,
1460 Palio,
330 Panda,
116 Stilo,
407 Idea,
381 Strada
 by the way, "north America" is classified as being America, Canada & Mexico

Yes but the quantity of Ferrari and Maserati puts that figure to shame  :-[

Neil

yeah its true to say North America isn't Fiat's biggest market, but would you look at the size of Brazil! Fiat in Brazil (this figure actually includes a tiny number of Alfa) have the no 1 spot, outselling GM & Volkswagen, ANE predict that by 2012 Fiat will be selling over 750k yearly in Brazil.

But isn't that because they actually make cars there?  Or am I confusing them with some other car manufacturer?

Neil

no, you're spot on Neil, Fiat made 723000 cars in Brazil last year, to show just how important Brazil is now, Fiat in Europe made 1.1million, but Fiat aren't no1 in Brazil purely because they make cars there, their range is very well received & Biofuel is huge in Brazil, so 99% of all Fiats made there are able to run on the stuff.

The amazing thing I find with these figures is the amount of Lancias sold comparative to Alfa Romeo, given that Alfa operates in more countries and has had far more investment in the product and marketing. I'm not sure if that reflects well on Lancia or poorly on Alfa, but is a surprise to me.

If you look at the Annual report FAG's financial success has generally come from the industrial sector, with huge growth and acquisitions in things like tractors, lorry's and specialist equipment, fuelled by it's dominant position in South America. The automotive side (Magnetti Marelli aside) provides cash but little profit. Lancia better make good use of the development investment they have been given, because I bet the shareholders won't let them have much more in the future if promises aren't met. I'm sure there is pressure to put the R&D into the profitable areas - and it is not difficult to see why there would be pressure to sell elements of the automotive side as they are undoubtedly holding back the share price.

i agree 100%, look at the money Fiat has poured into Alfa over the years, updated 147, new 159 & Brera, Alfa should be on another planet compared to Lancia, what has Lancia gotten over the past 4 years-one new model!

I've said it time & time again, if Fiat just invested more into Lancia they could be selling in much bigger numbers. Basically Lancia rely on 2 models, the Ypsilon & Musa they account for 95% of all Lancia sales, imagine what Lancia could do with a more complete range! Of the 2 "semi premium" brands that Fiat have i believe Lancia has the greater chance of breaking the 300k mark set by Marchonnie for 2010, i can't see Alfa doing it, not sure any goodwill is there anymore for Alfa.

There's a lot to that Toby.  The 159 is not half the car it could be, and the Brera is not even half the car it should be - probably bested by the GT, which is older and cheaper.  The 147 is ageing gracefully but needs replacing.  The MiTo needs to be really good, because the rest of the range is at best a curate's egg.  You buy an Alfa with the heart, not because its the best car in its class, or anywhere close.  The 159 and Brera, at least, should be near the top of the class - but in fact if anything its the GT which stands up best to scrutiny.  The other reason for wanting the MiTo to be really good is because it tells us a lot about how good, or otherwise, the new Ypsi (and ultimately Musa?) will be - and for Lancia's sake, both need to be really good cars.  The Delta, I think, is a love it or hate it car, a niche product that enough people will really want - and if Lancia can sort out the ride/handling/steering settings to optimise that, then the worst crticism that can be levelled at it, that the ride is fine but the handing and steering are a bit lifeless, might be resolved.  Comments on here suggest that the settings on various prototypes have varied, and can make a big difference.  But Lancia's performance vs Alfa is intriguing - fewer markets and fewer new models - what can Lancia do with new models and new markets.  5000 orders for the Delta in Italy in two weeks suggests a little of the potential...