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Author Topic: Report on (slow) S2 Coupe rebuild progress  (Read 65070 times)
0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.
nistri
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Posts: 336


« Reply #360 on: 03 May, 2020, 02:25:05 PM »

Hose connectors need patience to come undone.

Tim, unfortunately going through my spares I could only find an aftermarket electronic regulator for the Bosch system. Pictures attached. Obviously the unit has to be fitted to the inner wing. BTW, my electronic regulators were fitted more than 20 y ago and never gave any problem. Andrea


* Bosch like regulator_1.JPG (1821.08 KB, 3072x2304 - viewed 61 times.)

* Bosch like regulator_2.JPG (1869.79 KB, 3072x2304 - viewed 60 times.)
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Andrea Nistri

Ardea S2
Appia S2
Fulvia GTE
Fulvia Sport 1.3 S
Fulvia Montecarlo
Fulvia Coupe 1.3 S
simonandjuliet
Permanent resident
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« Reply #361 on: 03 May, 2020, 03:40:39 PM »

Re hose connectors - I found the easiest way is to back them off half a turn with a pair of pliers (or screwdriver in the loop) - I made a couple of 1/4" sockets to do this
Then pull the pin up and out of the connector ie perpendicular to to the bands and along the length of the pipe. Sometimes you may need to use a screwdriver blade to very carefully open the two halves of the pin (just like a split-pin)

A bit of WD40 may also help if they are rusted

To re-use them, straighten out the band, refit the pin and rethread the band - round once and then thread through the split-pin and rotate ...
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S1 Aprilia Cabrio, S2 Aprilia, S1 Promiscuo,S2 camioncino, S2 furgoncino, , R4 Sinpar, R4 Rodeo, R60 Tractor,R60 S, Moto Guzzi Ercole, Disco 3, Mini ALL4 JCW, Moto Guzzi Cardellino 73,Fulvia Berlina GT, Fulvia Rallye S, Royal Enfield Himalayan
frankxhv773t
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Posts: 1828



« Reply #362 on: 03 May, 2020, 04:41:16 PM »

I found a 3/8 socket fitted nicely to undo the hose clamps. It's easier than getting a screwdriver in the loop or gripping with pliers.


* hose connectors.JPG (2544.1 KB, 3456x2304 - viewed 57 times.)
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nthomas1
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Posts: 705



« Reply #363 on: 03 May, 2020, 05:38:31 PM »


Brilliant, worked a treat! Thank you Simon and Frank.  I think I could have stared at that fitting all day and not figured out how to release it.
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Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
nthomas1
Rebel Poster
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Posts: 705



« Reply #364 on: 03 May, 2020, 05:57:23 PM »


A couple more questions:  Do the numbers on the wires in the wiring diagram, 1, 1.5, 2, 2.5, 4, 6 represent the squared area of the metal cores?  And secondly, I've read somewhere about the application of a spray to electrical connections to waterproof them.  Is that a good idea, and is there a recommended product?
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Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
SanRemo78
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Posts: 650



« Reply #365 on: 03 May, 2020, 06:35:51 PM »

If you need any more relay holders Norm.... Got a shedload!

Guy
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nthomas1
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Posts: 705



« Reply #366 on: 06 May, 2020, 06:56:44 PM »

Engine bay electrical reconnections are now complete. Bodged wiring has all been replaced, and new green wire runs have replaced the poorly attached red wires for the inner headlamps.  New junction blocks have replaced many the poorly executed wiring connections.

Before I start on the dashboard wiring, where I have about half a dozen unconnected wires to investigate, I thought Iíd install the heater hoses and components.  I first took a close look at the dashboard heater controls, armed with Simonís thread on refurbishing the levers, expecting to have to dismantle the mechanism, but discovered that my levers and operating mechanism to be in good condition.  A good cleaning and some spray grease down the cable sheaths has the middle and lower levers and the flaps that they operate all working smoothly.  

The top lever moves freely, but there was clearly something amiss with the linkage rods to the left of the console. The left hand rod shown in the first picture is not connected at its top end, and thereís nothing in place to connect it to the top pivoting arm.  Can anybody confirm that the top of this rod should connect to that arm?  I would have expected the top of the rod to have a short length bent at right angles, and a white plastic/nylon fitting to hold it in place in a hole in the top lever.  That would be consistent with the way the other rod ends are connected.  You can see from picture 2 that the rod in my car is straight at the top end, as though the end has snapped off.  Iím guessing a replacement rod and fitting will be hard to find.

The second problem I encountered was that the water valve is seized solid.  I was able to pull the plunger arm out a centimetre or so with quite a lot of force.  Iíve got it soaked with WD40 overnight but it looks like a replacement will be needed.  There were hard deposits on one of the inlet tubes, so maybe a de-scaler of some sort would be worth trying.


* Screen Shot 2020-05-06 at 19.49.17.png (874.75 KB, 850x536 - viewed 63 times.)
« Last Edit: 06 May, 2020, 07:35:58 PM by nthomas1 » Logged

Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
nthomas1
Rebel Poster
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Posts: 705



« Reply #367 on: 07 May, 2020, 09:03:11 PM »


I installed the heater hoses today, though they are not yet connected in the passenger footwell as Iím still trying to free up the heater valve per yesterdayís post.  Iím keen to get answers to my questions about the heater connecting rods if anyone can help.


* Screen Shot 2020-05-07 at 21.35.49.png (832.96 KB, 1020x435 - viewed 61 times.)
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Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
Paul Johnson
Member
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Posts: 18


« Reply #368 on: 08 May, 2020, 05:17:24 AM »

Norm,
Have you read my ďHello, new to the forum & heater fixĒ thread I posted last month? It describes my (successful) dealings with the heating system in my Fulvia. The pipes up to and including the water valve were severely caked up with solidified radiator water/antifreeze highly likely as a result of this part of the system never been used- I suspect that the car was only used intermittently and then never when the weather required the use of the heater. As a consequence the water never circulated around the heater matrix and it slowly solidified. I disassembled the whole system and once out of the car, the valve popped open once de-caked using water only. It has worked perfectly since. I was mostly concerned about leaks thereafter as the gasket between the valve and the bulkhead was unusable after disassembly. However some liquid gasket goob did the trick!
In so far as your heater cables and linkages, Iím sorry, but I havenít been brave enough to go under the dash to look at mine which do need attention as the top temperature slide control is very stiff.
Good luck- a lovely job you are doing there.
Paul
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1972 Fulvia S2
nthomas1
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« Reply #369 on: 08 May, 2020, 05:30:58 AM »

Hi Paul - yes I had read your post and was hoping that my valve would pop open like yours, but it hasnít!  It will move but only with more force applied than I think the complex linkage mechanism would be able to handle.  Iíve had it soaking in a lemon juice solution over night.  I may have to drill out the fastening in the attached lever arm as that was heavily rusted and may be contributing to the stiffness.

With regard to my question about the linkage rod, that is in the area beside the glovebox high up in the passenger footwell. Iím hoping somebody can help me with that.
« Last Edit: 08 May, 2020, 05:55:59 AM by nthomas1 » Logged

Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
lancialulu
Press Officer
Permanent resident
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Posts: 4038



« Reply #370 on: 08 May, 2020, 07:14:15 AM »

Hi Paul - yes I had read your post and was hoping that my valve would pop open like yours, but it hasnít!  It will move but only with more force applied than I think the complex linkage mechanism would be able to handle.  Iíve had it soaking in a lemon juice solution over night.  I may have to drill out the fastening in the attached lever arm as that was heavily rusted and may be contributing to the stiffness.

With regard to my question about the linkage rod, that is in the area beside the glovebox high up in the passenger footwell. Iím hoping somebody can help me with that.

Norman do you have the dash top off. Reason for asking is that the levers on the facia operate bowden cables which in turn operate the rods you mention. When a valve stops working the red lever (water valve regulator) bends the bowden cable and it can never operate the valve successfully again as the cable will always bend rather than push. The mech advantage of the lever onto the valve operation is very poor, and the cable bends at the slightest stiffness of the valve. When new no problem..... (think probably a new valve is an option going forward if they were not so expensive...). The other levers seem to cope. So you need to check the bowden cable... then with dashtop off you should see all the connection...
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Its not the winning but taking part! or is it taking apart?
1955 Aurelia B12
1967 Flavia Vignale iniezione
1967 Fulvia 1.3HFR
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 1600 Fulvia Sport
1979 2500 Gamma Coupe
1988 Delta 1.6GTi
1998 Zeta
nthomas1
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« Reply #371 on: 08 May, 2020, 07:35:53 AM »

Hi Tim - yes, the dash top is off and the mechanism in its entirety is clear to see. The operating lever in the dash panel works fine, and the bowden cable seems to work correctly.  I suspect that the order of events was that the valve jammed at some stage and excessive force was used to try to push the lever to the left causing the rod (which I talked about above) to snap at its top end.  That's why I'm trying to get confirmation that the rod (the left hand one in the first picture, that links to the valve) should in fact be connected to the top lever arm via a bent over portion and a white nylon clip.

Here's a picture of the valve end of that rod.  I suspect that the top end should have the same bend, and plastic/nylon fitting, or is it attached in some other way?  

I've found replacement valves on a couple of supplier's websites for about 90 euros so that is the way forward if mine does not free up.  But not worth pursuing if I can't resolve the question of how the control rod fastens.  And then I need to find a replacement and fitting!


* IMG_6005 copy.JPG (721.33 KB, 1559x1448 - viewed 57 times.)
« Last Edit: 08 May, 2020, 07:41:26 AM by nthomas1 » Logged

Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
nthomas1
Rebel Poster
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Posts: 705



« Reply #372 on: 08 May, 2020, 10:21:39 AM »


An update.  The overnight soak in lemon juice solution did the trick and the valve is now moving freely.  However, testing it with water poured in, and not under pressure, the valve still allows about ten percent of the water through when closed.  It may be that an internal seal has hardened, so I'm now soaking it in WD40 and will try again later.  I may still need a new valve.

Now to the operating rod for the top lever. 

The pair of pictures below shows the two ends.  I had suspected that both ends should have the right angle bend, but a close look at the straight end shows no obvious signs of breakage.  So the question remains: how was that rod connected at the top end to the operating lever?  The final picture below shows the end of that lever (against the piece of white card), with a hole where the fitting must have been attached.  It is right at the corner where the base of the glove compartment meets the rear upright portion.  It should be visible from the footwell with the aid of a torch. Could somebody kindly take a look at their car for me and tell me what sort of connection for the rod is there.  It would be much appreciated. 


* a - Valve.JPG (668.7 KB, 1276x1102 - viewed 53 times.)

* b - Rod .png (935.28 KB, 907x460 - viewed 53 times.)

* c - Lever.JPG (949.91 KB, 1843x1745 - viewed 55 times.)
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Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
nistri
Megaposter
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Posts: 336


« Reply #373 on: 08 May, 2020, 10:22:35 AM »

I have never seen a heater valve rescued from corrosion/heavy scaling. A new one must operate very smoothly (possibly the same as in Beta coupe). As for the rod fixing, I sorted mine so long ago that I don't remember now (old age?) but I don't recall it too difficult, Andrea
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Andrea Nistri

Ardea S2
Appia S2
Fulvia GTE
Fulvia Sport 1.3 S
Fulvia Montecarlo
Fulvia Coupe 1.3 S
nthomas1
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Posts: 705



« Reply #374 on: 08 May, 2020, 10:47:05 AM »


Thanks Andrea. It doesnít look like it will be a difficult job. I just donít know what the fitting looks like!
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Norm Thomas
Ormskirk, Lancashire

Own:
1973 Fulvia S2 Coupe
Various modern cars
Previous Lancias: S2 Coupe and S3 Coupe in late 1970s
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