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Author Topic: TSU 306 - the restoration begins  (Read 15104 times)
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sd39
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Posts: 121



« Reply #90 on: 04 October, 2020, 05:01:14 PM »

Water pump sagas

I have the original sedan working now and have driven it, but as suspected the water pump leaks, so I can't really use it until I sort one that works. I have stripped down a replacement secondhand that Jim sent, and this is a much better housing and seal mating face. However, the seal I have got - the same as the first - doesn't seem to fit in the seat regardless of which way you place it. It just doesn't go into the seat.

So my question is were there different designs, and can you get different seals? The impeller on this replacement one, which I have broke in getting it stripped down, was not in brass like my original one.

Any suggestion would be most welcome

 


* IMG_2184.jpeg (732.83 KB, 1417x1890 - viewed 131 times.)

* Screenshot 2020-09-22 at 19.55.35.png (168.54 KB, 2006x1148 - viewed 125 times.)
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
sd39
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« Reply #91 on: 04 October, 2020, 05:02:11 PM »

whoops, wrong photo. Sorry


* IMG_2185.jpeg (769.17 KB, 1417x1890 - viewed 136 times.)
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
nistri
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« Reply #92 on: 04 October, 2020, 05:41:28 PM »

There were 3 types of seal (not interchangeable). Cavalitto did not stock them when I contacted him recently. However, a good machine shop can adapt the housing to a modern seal: this was done successfully on mine, Andrea

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Andrea Nistri

Ardea S2
Appia S2
Fulvia GTE
Fulvia Sport 1.3 S
Fulvia Montecarlo
Fulvia Coupe 1.3 S
sd39
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Posts: 121



« Reply #93 on: 05 October, 2020, 04:19:00 PM »

Ahh, right. So the objective would be to take out sufficient metal from the wall so the hard rubber surface sits on the face?

That makes sense

Thats great thanks
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
nistri
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« Reply #94 on: 06 October, 2020, 07:42:48 AM »

Yes, correct, good luck, Andrea
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Andrea Nistri

Ardea S2
Appia S2
Fulvia GTE
Fulvia Sport 1.3 S
Fulvia Montecarlo
Fulvia Coupe 1.3 S
sd39
Senior Member
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Posts: 121



« Reply #95 on: 01 November, 2020, 08:46:50 PM »

As I noted on  Dave Kennedy's post, had the housing machined out as per Andrea's comment. Radiator out, rebuilt pump (funny how the first time takes ages, repeat rebuilds/strip-downs, a third of the time), radiator in, and ran the engine for a good long while, and no leaks. So fingers crossed this might have solved it

I'll follow Dave's lead if it starts leaking again

Need to insure the car now and start using it!

Need to start stripping down the new body!
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
sd39
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Posts: 121



« Reply #96 on: 28 December, 2020, 08:35:29 AM »

Update

Water pump is holding water, so thank you for the advice

Car is and has been on the road legally. Hurrah! But it has an issue with front wheel hubs which means I can't drive very far.  Initially I thought it was the hub bearings, but it's not that. After about a five mile journey both front hubs get very hot and the wheels do not turn by hand on axle stands, though they turn very freely when cold. That is, the brake shoes seem to expand and seize onto the recently skimmed drums. The shoes have been resurfaced, but as I say the drums/hub go on (and off) easily when cold (I don't have to use a puller). I have adjusted the four eccentric lobes to the mid point where the wheels turn most easily.

I was going to remove the hubs again today, take the shoes off, and ensure that that the eccentric lobes are in their lowest setting visually, but we have snow and its still snowing and the garage isn't so big that it'll all get a bit wet. So I thought I'd get some thoughts before having another look twm.

Could it be something about how I have put the shoes back on that is causing this? Are all the shoes the same? Have I put them on incorrectly?

Any ideas?
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
lancialulu
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« Reply #97 on: 28 December, 2020, 08:43:52 AM »

Is there a build up of pressure in the hydraulic system? Collapsed hoses?
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Its not the winning but taking part! or is it taking apart?
1955 Aurelia B12
1967 Flavia Vignale iniezione
1967 Fulvia 1.3HFR
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 1600 Fulvia Sport
1979 2500 Gamma Coupe
1988 Delta 1.6GTi
1998 Zeta
chriswgawne
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« Reply #98 on: 28 December, 2020, 09:31:41 AM »

Sounds like a typical brake master cylinder problem to me where the seal carrier and seal do not return to rest after pedal pressure. In the past I have been told that this quite  often happens after re-sealing with Appia and Aurelia master cylinders. The solution is to ensure the bore of the aluminium master cylinder is very highly polished and to double check, run a bench test.
Chris  .
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Chris Gawne
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nistri
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« Reply #99 on: 28 December, 2020, 10:15:39 AM »

The flexihoses can also deteriorate internally and produce this kind of problem in addition to the likely master cylinder issue, Andrea
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Andrea Nistri

Ardea S2
Appia S2
Fulvia GTE
Fulvia Sport 1.3 S
Fulvia Montecarlo
Fulvia Coupe 1.3 S
sd39
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Posts: 121



« Reply #100 on: 28 December, 2020, 08:52:31 PM »

Perfect. The master cylinder hasn't been used for 16 years whilst the car was stood in the US, so that is very likely to be the problem. I'll replace the hoses too!

Many thanks
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
sd39
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Posts: 121



« Reply #101 on: 30 December, 2020, 11:31:03 AM »

I have ordered the seal kit and hoses.

In the manual there are instructions for Simplex and Duplex, and I am assuming that a Series 3 is Duplex (this is what's mentioned in the driver handbook)? Are there any other issues I should look out for in dismantling and refurbishing the master cylinder?
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
sd39
Senior Member
*****
Posts: 121



« Reply #102 on: 02 January, 2021, 07:22:05 PM »

Spent today removing the brake master cylinder. Tough job! Exhaust manifold off. One of the 19mm copper pipes nut wouldn't undo with the short spanner, which is all that will go in that space. Thankfully, I was able to take the cylinder and pipe out together (having undone at the brake reservoir connection - this will also get a bit of a clean) and then undo the pipe nut on the bench. So all done now, ready for the strip down of the cylinder itself.

Seal kit on its way. Thanks Jim
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
sd39
Senior Member
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Posts: 121



« Reply #103 on: 26 March, 2021, 06:18:45 PM »

Haven't been able to get in the garage for a while, but last weekend I got the brake master cylinder back on and system bled. All seems to be well, and problem solved judging by the short test drive. I have a week off work now and will get the front brake hoses replaced. to complete the job
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1960 Lancia Appia Series 3 Sedan, 1966 Lancia Fulvia coupe, 1980 Suzuki FZ50, Bob Jackson bicycle.
GerardJPC
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« Reply #104 on: 28 March, 2021, 06:17:28 AM »

That all sounds very good.  Having had new cylinders fitted to my Appia's rear brakes, I hope that its master cylinder is OK but haven't tested the brakes yet as the car's new alternator is still to be wired in.
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1962 Appia Berlina
1975 2000 HF Coupe
1979 Beta 1600 Coupe

1973 Fiat 124 Sport Coupe
1977 Princess 2200 HL
1981 Lotus Eclat S2 FOR SALE
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