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Author Topic: Brake bleeding fulvias  (Read 7479 times)
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Scarpia
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« on: 26 September, 2007, 07:12:11 AM »

Anyone any useful tips for this job. I have done it many times over the years and never yet done it with any ease or great success.Is it just me or is it more difficult on a fulvia than other cars?
In this case its a series 2, 1.3s with dual circuit .
I also have a one way "bleeding" kit.
The order I use is top front nipples; bottom front; and then the rear. This is in fact contrary to the general advise of furthest away first but that also wasn't very successful either.Also, once air gets into the master cylinder after a completely dry system, how do you get fluid to pump through at all? I had a devil of a job to get any action as a consequence of pumping the pedal whilst bleeding last time I rebuilt the brakes.I"ll be facing the same problem soon I suspect.I can rebuild an engine but I always struggle with brake bleeding on cars.!Should I see a therapist or am I just mechanically inadequate....?
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stanley sweet
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« Reply #1 on: 26 September, 2007, 11:02:09 AM »

Had the same problem on mine a couple of years back after rebuilding the master cylinder. I was pumping the pedal as my friend went around bleeding them as on a normal car. There was no pressure building at all and eventually I saw brake fluid running down the bulkhead. I had a look at a Lancia site and discovered the fronts have to be bled first, then the backs. Back in the workshop the following evening I told Graham what I'd discovered and he'd also found that the master cylinder has to be rebuilt 'wet'. Did that, bled the front first and the rears last and everything went perfectly. Have you someone to help you? Makes it much easier. It sounds like you've been doing it right anyway so I'm not sure what else you can do. Think I found the answer on the Viva lancia site in the Q and A's.
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1971 Fulvia 1.3S 'Leggera'  1999 Lancia Lybra 1.9JTD LX SW
Scarpia
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« Reply #2 on: 26 September, 2007, 11:44:09 AM »

Quote
Back in the workshop the following evening I told Graham what I'd discovered and he'd also found that the master cylinder has to be rebuilt 'wet'.

I always end up immersed in brake fluid when I perform this job.Does that count as a wet rebuild.?
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lancialulu
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« Reply #3 on: 26 September, 2007, 08:35:44 PM »

After a frustrating time once Omicron said just open the bleed nipple at the back and go for a cup of tea. When fluid emerges do same with next and so on. Then bleed as normal. Seemed to work but agree a helper to operate pedal makes it much quicker.
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ColinMarr
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« Reply #4 on: 26 September, 2007, 10:22:10 PM »

I too can remember having problems in bleeding Fulvia brakes. I found it impossible to do single-handed and I seem to think the crucial thing was to close-off the bleed nipple while the brake pedal was fully depressed by the foot of some helpful assistant.
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nistri
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« Reply #5 on: 27 September, 2007, 03:04:37 PM »

Using a Gunson closed system bleeding tool (widely available from Halfords) connected to a spare tyre inflated at low pressure (about 1 bar) is the simplest and fastest method to bleed S1 or S2 Fulvia brakes after complete emptying the master cylinder reservoir (something to be done every 12-24 months regardless of use). This tool works wonders even on rallye S and GTE master cylinders with their remote servos (usually the most difficult to bleed). Note that a special fitting has to be fabricated to adapt the tool to the Fulvia reservoir. For this purpose I used a wine bottle cork through which the plastic tube was inserted and sealed. Good luck. 
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Andrea Nistri

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Scarpia
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« Reply #6 on: 27 September, 2007, 04:38:52 PM »

I assume from the presence of an inflated tyre and the cork that one creates a pressure at the filler cap and force fluid through the system?  I was trying to bodge around using a pump from an inflatable matress having decided this was the right approach.Didn't work but your method sounds much more practical.In essence it achieves the same result as the sprung pump on the Aprilia system which makes bleeding the brakes a one man job also.

As there are always plenty of used wine corks around our house I just have to go and look for a spare tyre......
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fay66
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« Reply #7 on: 27 September, 2007, 10:24:22 PM »

The Gunson Eezibleed has been around a long time I've had mine about 40 years! must admit though it's a bit disconcerting when you connect in to the tyre & the plastc reservoir inflates Shocked Always thought one of these days one will explode, but it's never happened.
With pressure pushing the fluid out of the eezibleed, into the reservoir then through the system to the open bleed nipple, there is no chance of introducing air into the system, & it pushes everything before it out of the bleed nipple into a collection jar.

Brian
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nistri
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« Reply #8 on: 28 September, 2007, 12:48:43 PM »

Yes, it is simple to use the Halfords system. I never saw a plastic reservoir inflating under pressure: it is advisable to use very low tyre pressure.
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Andrea Nistri

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fay66
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« Reply #9 on: 28 September, 2007, 05:01:44 PM »

Hi Andrea,
The inflating reservoir wasn't on a Lancia I would hasten to had, but with the British Girling reservoirs in the 60's, it was quiter common even using the recommended tyre pressure Roll Eyes

Brian
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Own 1966 Fulvia 2C Berlina since 1997, back on road 11-1999.Known as "Fay"
1999 Suzuki Wagon R+ GL, now my daughters
2006 Renault Megane 1 5 Dci Sports Tourer
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Scarpia
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« Reply #10 on: 28 September, 2007, 06:21:03 PM »

Thanks for the tips everyone.This is precisely what I like about the forum.You learn new approaches quickly from people that have dealt with the same problems rather than having to re invent the wheel.thanks.
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Richard Fridd
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« Reply #11 on: 28 September, 2007, 06:39:53 PM »

one lesson i did learn the hard way was to keep the cap on the brake fluid resevoir when bleeding the system in the conventional way.i once experienced damage to new front wing paintwork with one application of the pedal.cant remember if something was amiss or if this is a general hazard
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Richard Nevison Fridd
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« Reply #12 on: 29 September, 2007, 07:44:56 AM »

Note - imVho, It is not advisable to COMPLETELY drain a Fulvia Master cylinder (or any m/cylinder for that matter) when replacing the fluid (as part of a routine service), reason being that you run the risk of introducing an airlock into the cylinder. "One" might argue that, by not removing all fluid, that this would mean that the object of the task - i.e. brake fluid replacement - had not be achieved, but don't forget, that, unless you remove and strip all the slave cylinders, you will always have old fluid "hanging around" here, possibly combined with a rusty residue.
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Neil
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« Reply #13 on: 29 September, 2007, 10:54:06 AM »

Chris, I would agree if you check the level of the fluid and top up as the level falls, before it gets too low, and use more fluid than required, not skimp of the quantity or quality, you should flush out the old fluid and any contamination and take your time you should not have any problems.
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Neil   
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Scarpia
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« Reply #14 on: 29 September, 2007, 11:23:40 AM »

and in the case where you have to completely replace or dismantle the master cylinder?

The question is how you re-establish  pressure in the system from scratch.Its always undesirable to get air in the system but is sometimes unavoidable.For general bleeding most posts below seem to favour a pressurised system. Does this also work when the system has been completely empty.? ( i read on the internet that whilst the above is effective , there are also vacuum systems that work from the "nipple end" that are "even" easier and more effective to use.)
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