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Author Topic: Fanalone restoration  (Read 81966 times)
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chugga boom
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« Reply #105 on: 26 June, 2009, 10:58:28 PM »

I have now put the crank in. It turns very nicely, so slowly it's beinging to look like an engine again  Grin

Two other activites on the go. The head is having the seats and valves machined. One valve would not lap in as the cut was slightly off center (the valve wasn't bent) and I am deciding what to do with the rocker shafts. Both were worn, the inlet had 20 thou wear in places.

Does anyone have any experience with metal spreying ? I have had conflicting advice on this - one engine specialist said unlikly it can be done as the oilways would become blocked up during the process, the other said it could probably be done. I can get new ones but they are ~200 for a pair.

What have others done in this situation ?

always been a bit scared of this idea, i'm sure it was my dad that had seen a cam or knew somone who'd had a cam metal sprayed and a piece came off, i suppose its how well its done at the end of it a bit like white metaling, if done propperly otherwise can be disastrous, i think id be more inclined to look for good second hand items, surly the same as 1300??
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1935 augusta lusso (chugga)
1935 belna saloon
1935 augusta lusso
1938 ardenne
1939 aprilia lusso
1958 appia s2
1963 appia s3 
195? appia camioncino
1972 fulvia 1600HF
1976 fulvia coupe
194? ardea SUV  "THE BEAST!!!"
ncundy
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« Reply #106 on: 03 July, 2009, 07:09:10 PM »

A bit more progress. Crank and block are reunited.

Still thinking about what to do about the rocker shafts. I think you are right Chugga. I'm not going to go down the spraying route. Current thinking is to see what the possibility is to make them. Material selection is looking like either EN24 or C35 steel, make slightly over size and hone the rockers. Anyone have any comments on that approach, I'm happy to hear them ?


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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
Philm
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« Reply #107 on: 03 July, 2009, 08:25:07 PM »

En24 sounds ok but it will need heat treating, there are better steels though depending on what you want to pay and who is machining them, what is he measurement of the rocker bores?
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DavidLaver
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« Reply #108 on: 03 July, 2009, 09:39:25 PM »


What's the finish on the block casting?

David
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David Laver, Lewisham.
ncundy
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« Reply #109 on: 03 July, 2009, 09:49:20 PM »

The shafts are just located in aluminum blocks on the head. The don't turn, they are for support and control only.

The diameter of the shaft is 15.973mm. Thought is to make them 16 dead and hone the rockers to fit (allowing for clearance). The rockers should be 16 dead but mine are slightly worn.The clearance should be about 0.04mm.

Regarding the material I started out thinking about heat treating but I'm not sure the originals are heat treated. I can scratch it with a file (just) which makes me think it is a hard alloy like EN24 but not heat treated. The other reason is that you should really run hard against soft (I know with cam followers and the like this doesn't hold) and I would rather the soft be the shaft than the rocker (easier to get shafts than rockers). I have exchanged mails with a gentleman in Germany who made his rocker shafts out of C45 (a con rod material slightly weaker than C35). He says the are fine. That has a UTS, yield strength and HB about 70% of EN24. He didn't heat treat them.

If I have to heat treat then I imagine I might as well buy some new as the cost would probably be more or less the same.

Whats your thoughts on that approach ?
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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
ncundy
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« Reply #110 on: 04 July, 2009, 12:18:28 PM »


What's the finish on the block casting?

David

Sorry David, misunderstood the question  Tongue

It's etch primer - you can get it from pretty much any motor factors / Halfords etc. I didn't use any of the advertised block paints as they are all in daft or non-original colours. But this was almost an exact match for the paint on the block, and I had some handy - I gave it a few coats.

Neil


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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
fay66
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« Reply #111 on: 04 July, 2009, 03:16:41 PM »

Neil,
It certainly looks better than my semi rust colour, does anyone know if all Fulvia had this colour finish, mine looks like it was black the first time the engine came out and was stripped was at about 28K, so I think it unlikely that it had been out before.


Brian
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Own 1966 Fulvia 2C Berlina since 1997, back on road 11-1999.Known as "Fay"
1999 Suzuki Wagon R+ GL, now my daughters
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ncundy
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« Reply #112 on: 05 July, 2009, 05:00:05 PM »

Brian,

This is a photo from a 1963 Lancia booklet (Straordinario Fulvia) covering the production facilities of the then new Fulvia (berlina). It is clearly black, so would more or less confirm your conclusion.

Later Lancia technical publications I have (S2 +) all seem to show grey (or possibly unpainted). Photos in various books covering the Fanalones (particularly Altorio) show grey (or again possibly unpainted). Like you, I doubt my engine has ever been out, so am pretty convident that grey was my colour, as black would seem to be your colour.

There is also a thread here on the subject if your Italian is any good Smiley , but it does suggest a RAL code (7035) for the grey.

When the change occured and if it is different coupes to berlinas I not seen anything conclusive.

Neil


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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
fay66
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« Reply #113 on: 05 July, 2009, 05:12:38 PM »

Thanks Neil,
Just about followed that using Altavista!

Brian
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Own 1966 Fulvia 2C Berlina since 1997, back on road 11-1999.Known as "Fay"
1999 Suzuki Wagon R+ GL, now my daughters
2006 Renault Megane 1 5 Dci Sports Tourer
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ncundy
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« Reply #114 on: 16 July, 2009, 06:22:34 PM »

Seeing all those cracking cars at the AGM (particularly Stans' Fanalone) has got me back into the garage with renewed optimism.

Whilst waiting for the rockers shaft solution I have set about the carbs. Nothing complicated about these (at least not in overhauling anyway) as long as they don't leak. Here is a before, during and after. The bizarre thing I found was that the fuel return passage on the fuel union was not drilled through ! Hmmm, they must have been keen to get away on that day  Roll Eyes


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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
DavidLaver
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« Reply #115 on: 16 July, 2009, 10:06:55 PM »


...and that claw hammer is for...?

David
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David Laver, Lewisham.
ncundy
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« Reply #116 on: 16 July, 2009, 10:36:02 PM »

That "claw hammer", as you so undelicately refer to it, is my beautifully balanced repercusive adjustment instrument. Yesterday it was carefully withdrawn from its packaging to adjust the tab washers on the butterfly shaft  Grin
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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
fay66
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« Reply #117 on: 17 July, 2009, 12:01:08 AM »

Looks just like my beautifully balanced repercussive adjustment instrument, just one of a set of similar instruments;D

Brian
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Own 1966 Fulvia 2C Berlina since 1997, back on road 11-1999.Known as "Fay"
1999 Suzuki Wagon R+ GL, now my daughters
2006 Renault Megane 1 5 Dci Sports Tourer
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ncundy
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« Reply #118 on: 31 August, 2009, 09:34:28 AM »

The head is almost complete now. After investigating getting some new rocker shafts made (and some good help from a German member of viva-lancia) Neal Shepherd came up trumps. He had had a set made up some time ago which he did not use and was happy to sell them on. As a bonus he had had them made dimensionally as I was considering (about 4 thou oversize to allow the rockers to be honed to take out any wear), and they are induction hardened.

Before assembling I diamond lapped all the bearing surfaces on the cams and rockers to take out the marks (probably water and acid - photo 4) and return to a nice ground finish (photo 5). This takes a bit of time but the result is cams that turn very freely. Then I made up a honing tool for the lathe and honed the rockers to fit. Everything has gone together, fits beautifully with no slop at all.

A note on the cam end bearings. I bought a new set from Cavallito and they needed a few hours fettling before they were good enough to fit. The location hole for the dowel was too small and not de-burred properly and when placed on the cam and turned with fingers it was possible to detect high points as it was rotated (did not spin freely). Some work with very fine (1500) paper relieved the high points, and a small drill end with fine wet and dry wrapped round relieved the hole to a nice fit. So don't assume these things are ready to fit when received.

Also the fuel pump has gone back on having sat on the shelf for a few months.


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1969 Fanalone, Mazda RX-8, Fiat Multipla
DavidLaver
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« Reply #119 on: 31 August, 2009, 05:44:01 PM »


It looks fabulous - and I expect its been most satisfying to improve all the fits to a silky perfection.

How exactly did you hone the rockers and cams?  Any pics of the lathe tool for the rocker bearings?

David
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David Laver, Lewisham.
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