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Author Topic: Integrale advice please  (Read 3283 times)
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stuwilson128
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« on: 17 February, 2012, 11:02:56 PM »

I have had an email from somebody who is considering buying an integrale and would like some advice.  I have copied his email below.

I am looking to replace one of 2 1950's classic sports cars that I have with something more useable, weatherproof etc etc. Top of the options is an Integrale EVO 1or 2.

My questions are:
What are the key things to look out for?
What are the pros and cons of EVO 1 v 2.?
Is there any logic to a 5-10k premium for the later version other than market demand?
Can these cars be considered realistically useable and enjoyable without being a heap of financial trouble?!
Hopefully a few current owners in the club might be able to convince me, or not!, to join them....

One important thing to add is that I would only buy a top notch car, so am not looking to do it on the cheap!!
 
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Stuart Wilson 11175
1973 Fulvia Coupe 1.3
2000 Lybra SW 2.4JTd
2009 Delta 1.9 Twin Turbo
nic038
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« Reply #1 on: 18 February, 2012, 12:29:26 PM »

plenty of buyers guides around, john whalley has one on his site,club lancia sports,evocorner.
a few quick answers without going into too much detail.
1/ issues to look for:
bodywork - without going to extreme- rust at base of windscreen,rear roof, behind rear bolsters where turrets are to name a few.engine-turbo smoking, cambelt changes, clutch,suspension-drop links, etc
2/ evo1 vs evo2 quite a few differences between seats,wheels,engine management,turbo and odd bits of exterior trim. as for the car itself biggest pro is the resale value 2's seem to be holding out a lot more in value.
3/ answer no, all about getting a good sound reliable car thats been looked after,and has reciepts/proven service history be it a evo1 or evo2.
4/yes.
5/ buying a "top notch car" will be most likely known to the clubs,go to a few shows first and speak with owners if not then spend time looking, and get a full inspection first before buying,the highest priced car for sale does not always guarantee it's the best you can get.

hope thats of some help, i'm sure there are others who can write up a more complex buyers guide.

think the same potential buyer has now posted up on evocorner.i'm sure he will get all his questions answered there.(plus a few extras  Wink )
« Last Edit: 18 February, 2012, 05:19:38 PM by nic038 » Logged

1994 Delta HF integrale
SteveGales
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« Reply #2 on: 18 February, 2012, 05:12:04 PM »

Nick's pretty much covered most things but here are a couple of others I've thought of.....

Bodywork, apart from rust which can vary wildly car to car ( I suppose the same for all cars really) another issue are 'stress cracks' on the
bodyshell. A by-product of a big increase in track, 4WD and about 3 times the power of the original Delta 1300!! Most if not all integrales (especially evos) will have some cracks generally found around the A post region/ top of door aperture.They can also occur in the chassis legs in the engine bay.
An easy check is to pull the felt trim off around the door opening and inspect the double skinned edge. The reason is obvious , factory spot welds are irregularly spaced , sometimes few and far between. The solution is to seam weld the double skinned flange and add extra spot welds. Little
strengthening plates can also be added at stress points ( as on the works cars) if very bad.This is not quite the 'jaw dropping' problem you may think. After reading an article by the late Barry Waterhouse in the club magazine I found some on my car and nearly fainted on the spot. This was on a low mileage , one owner car but crucially it had uprated FE springs which no doubt had not helped the shell. I had the cracks welded , extra spot  and a little seam welding near the cracks done, this was 10 years ago and they have never come back.
I soon returned the car to standard suspension which made a great difference to comfort and ride quality, especially useful now with our rubbish roads.

The Delta is very tuneable and a lot are modified, it depends what you want it for really but IMHO they are plenty quick enough and handle / steer fantastically even in standard form. As numbers of good cars decrease I would suggest these will also probably worth more.

With regards to useability , very easy to drive ( whilst always making you feel like Miki Biasion, Marku Alen !), great in traffic even in summer.
Mid 20's consumption early 30's on a long run taking it easy. The car is also surprisingly easy to work on for basic servicing , brakes etc and not
prohibatively expensive even for such things as cam belt changes.
One proviso I would say is parts availability especially body panels.... i.e no new ones available! Even such mundane/ routine items such as shock absorbers can be a problem although there are more modern alternatives available. The situation is slowly improving however with
parts being re-manufactured by the specialists all the time.

As Nick said evo 1 /2 differences are mainly cosmetic although arguably the evo 2 interior is more attractive has standard air con etc. On the other hand the evo 1 is supposed to have a bigger 'kick in the back' due to the larger turbo ....'you pay your money....'

Regarding enjoyment , there is no contest, take an integrale down you favourite twisty road and you will be amazed at what it can do,
every country road will become a rally stage  ! Oh, and be prepared to talk about the car because every time you stop at petrol stations etc people will come up and ask you questions about it ! Bikers love them too , turning round to give you a 'thumbs up ' as they go past.

Hope we've convinced you !!
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ben
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« Reply #3 on: 18 February, 2012, 07:24:21 PM »

I notice you don't consider the earlier pre-evo cars and I wondered why? I have run a black 8valve as an almost everyday car for several years and take enormous pleasure from it (far more frequently than the show car owners!)
I also have a red one in very good condition which I had on show at Covent Garden a few years ago and more recently at the NEC. For some reason they don't command anything like the same money as the later cars as I found out when I tried to sell it last year. It is of course harder to find a good standard car as so few have survived un-molested.However they are about and if you were interested your search could end here!
                                                                                                                                           Ben Courage
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Jolly_Club_6
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« Reply #4 on: 20 February, 2012, 11:50:06 AM »

All the above and you won't go far wrong, but if know anyone with experience of a Delta, preferably mechanically minded, take them with you to check the car/engine over.  Wink
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sparehead3
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« Reply #5 on: 20 February, 2012, 11:59:37 AM »

Stuart, the guy is down in Devon I think - Bristol Italian Auto Moto will be the nearest show where there are going to be some to see - also Goodwood Track Day would be a good place as you'd probably have the whole range including track cars. I think it must be fairly true that any integrale that has been around to shows will be known and will probably have photos on the internet.
I can't imagine that any these days would not have had some work done ....
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Regards,
Steve Pilgrim
No.13575

1993 Delta HF integrale Evo II (Hammond's Icon - No.4)

http://www.lanciadb.co.uk/
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