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Author Topic: assembling sliding pillar  (Read 1875 times)
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DavidHill
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Posts: 64


« on: 29 June, 2022, 09:07:04 PM »

evening all, 

any tips/techniques for putting the main springs back into the sliding pillar???  I can just about compress the spring with a hydraulic jack, but then I'm very wary of cross threading the big lower spring holder thread as it goes into the sliding pillar.  As its all under tension (and at a bit of an angle) its very difficult to make sure the thread is engaging correctly.  surely there is an easier method??
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simonandjuliet
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« Reply #1 on: 30 June, 2022, 07:52:51 AM »

I use an old bearing on top of the jack so that even under pressure I can "feel" the threads better - have you refitted the upper part ? If you haven't it may give a bit more leeway as well, but as you suggest, do everything to avoid cross threading the very fine threads !!
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Amilcar CGS, Aprilia Cabrio, S2Aprilia, Ardea camioncino, S2 camioncino, S2 furgoncino, R4 Sinpar, R4 Rodeo, 65 Moke, R60 Tractor, R60 S, Toselli 78, Moto Guzzi Ercole, Disco 3, Mini ALL4 JCW, Moto Guzzi Cardellino, Fulvia GT, RE Himalayan, Ypsilon
williamcorke
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Posts: 613


B10


« Reply #2 on: 30 June, 2022, 09:28:39 AM »

I had a tool made, modelled on the one shown below.

It has a thrust bearing between the 'key' that engages with the base section of the unit and the bottom plate of the tool, rather as the old bearing that Simon suggests for the 'use a jack' approach.




* FEAB6A6B-04ED-4A3D-AEC8-C6F06F389106.jpeg (427.65 KB, 1152x2048 - viewed 16 times.)
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'37 Aprilia
'50 B10
'53 B20
'68 Flavia Vignale
'55 Giulietta Sprint
S1 Land Rover
DavidHill
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Posts: 64


« Reply #3 on: 30 June, 2022, 07:03:12 PM »

Thanks Simon and William,

I very carefully cleaned out the threads and test assembled a number of times without the spring before using the hydraulic jack to compress the spring.  I did not attach the top bush housing so the sliding pillar was free to rotate and wobble a bit to get a better chance at good engagement with the thread....it worked nicely and I tightened the nut smoothly with no cross threading - until i got to the point shown in the photo.  I think now all the slack is gone from the spring/sliding pillar and the bottom thread is compressing the spring further as I tighten it.  It is now very very difficult to do up further- is that normal? Do I now need to apply further pressure with the jack, whilst at the same time using a very long lever on the nut?


* sp30.jpg (669.54 KB, 2016x1512 - viewed 19 times.)
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Raahauge
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Posts: 84


« Reply #4 on: 30 June, 2022, 08:33:32 PM »

Have you checked that the lower sheet metal sleeve that holds the oil has correctly entered into the spring dust cover?
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williamcorke
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Posts: 613


B10


« Reply #5 on: 01 July, 2022, 09:04:42 AM »

Personally, I would be nervous of applying too much torque to that nut. The part you are screwing in is made of several pieces brazed (or even soldered) together and you might crack the braze/solder or worse.

The 'key' / teeth on the base are there for the purpose of assembly / disassembly. Photo below shows cracking of the solder on Noel's car, and the keys.

In my opinion you should get hold of (borrow, or have made) a tool that can apply the necessary force to fully tighten things up, without risk of damage. Simon has a LOT more experience of this subject than I do and might well disagree!



* Screenshot 2022-07-01 at 09.59.34.png (2125.06 KB, 1344x978 - viewed 18 times.)

* Screenshot 2022-07-01 at 09.59.09.png (368.89 KB, 480x524 - viewed 217 times.)
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'37 Aprilia
'50 B10
'53 B20
'68 Flavia Vignale
'55 Giulietta Sprint
S1 Land Rover
DavidHill
Member
****
Posts: 64


« Reply #6 on: 01 July, 2022, 12:27:35 PM »

Hi William,

no completely agree...will be using the 48mm socket i adapted to engage with the "teeth" in the outer ring...

ref your question Mike, the two thin metal sleeves are not yet overlapping, so that is not causing the tightness on doing up the bottom holder further...


* socket1.jpg (617.84 KB, 1512x2016 - viewed 18 times.)
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LatheJon
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Posts: 13


« Reply #7 on: 01 July, 2022, 01:16:46 PM »

The Harry Manning Method as I recall. An adjustable, pointed at the top, Stand was placed on the ground. The "Socket" was placed on the stand under the lower nut part, and the weight of the car compressed the spring, the same stand but different socket/spanner was used for b20`s etc
Harry had made a number of sets of these stand and  socket tools, and many B20 owners bought them.
« Last Edit: 01 July, 2022, 03:15:35 PM by LatheJon » Logged
Raahauge
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Posts: 84


« Reply #8 on: 01 July, 2022, 08:59:00 PM »

There is something odd. I suggested the sleeves fouling because I had experienced that although with so little thread left to tighten I did think they should have already overlapped. I have about 25mm of overlap on full droop when everything is assembled whereas it seems you will have nothing like that. A decent amount of overlap is desirable to keep road spray out.
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Raahauge
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Posts: 84


« Reply #9 on: 02 July, 2022, 04:11:38 PM »

Correction, sorry, I have about 9mm overlap on full droop.
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DavidHill
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Posts: 64


« Reply #10 on: 02 July, 2022, 06:45:45 PM »

hmm, i have about 1-2mm overlap on full droop  - you are right Mike that does seem low (see picture).

I have disassembled the sliding pillar again as I had a leek from the lower spring holder (so some soldering to do). I also have a car lift coming next week so i can get the whole car and axle a good height off the ground and get much better access to the sliding pillar on assembly with a jack and also a pivot/bearing into action better too.  Will update later next week.


* sp02.jpg (692.06 KB, 1512x2016 - viewed 16 times.)
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DavidHill
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Posts: 64


« Reply #11 on: 03 July, 2022, 06:52:34 PM »

I have just noticed there is a circlip (part number 38-73120) in the attached TAV. this seems to ensure that part number 38-606 remains screwed into the lower kingpin.  Is that important, has anyone had experience of these becoming undone without the circlip?


* SP Tav early series 1.jpg (1177.04 KB, 1512x2016 - viewed 22 times.)
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Kari
Senior Member
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Posts: 137


« Reply #12 on: 04 July, 2022, 07:59:39 AM »

You can be sure that there is a purpose for this circlip. The lower guide (38-606) is subject to constantly changing side loads. If it becomes loose, the steering and suspension is compromised.
Photo is from an Augusta suspension, quite similar to the Aprilia.

regards  Karl


* IMG_3142a.jpg (528.43 KB, 1632x1224 - viewed 21 times.)
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davidwheeler
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« Reply #13 on: 04 July, 2022, 04:43:34 PM »

I made a spanner from an appropriate sized tube with a pair of slots cut in one end and the other end rests on the floor with the car/spring/nut sitting on top, but other folks' tools are much more elegant than mine!
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David Wheeler.  Lambdas, Aprilia, Fulvia Sport.(formerly Appia and Thema as well).
DavidHill
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Posts: 64


« Reply #14 on: 09 July, 2022, 09:48:57 PM »

evening All,

the bottom spring holder has now been taken apart and re-soldered and passed its oil leak test, and the car lift has arrived...so onwards to assembly!  One question - has anyone any tips on how to insert the circlip (part no. 38-73120 in the TAV above) i tried that this evening and it seems almost impossible to get into the small hole and inside the groove??
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