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Author Topic: Magnetti Marelli distributor cleaning  (Read 923 times)
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lancialulu
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« Reply #15 on: 29 September, 2020, 02:19:48 PM »

Are the plugs new? I know NGK plugs, once oiled, are near impossible to get working properly again.
I am a fan of NGK and would rather have them to champion..... The Fulvia HF has these small diameter plugs that often drop on infrequent starting but I have never had NGK continue to fail after a clean and airline but had all sorts with Champion.
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1955 Aurelia B12
1967 Flavia Vignale iniezione
1967 Fulvia 1.3HFR
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 1600 Fulvia Sport
1979 2500 Gamma Coupe
1988 Delta 1.6GTi
1998 Zeta
BolognaFulvia
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« Reply #16 on: 29 September, 2020, 02:43:39 PM »

Afternoon, having found this forum to be invaluable over the last two years recommissioning my 1976 1.3s I think I am in a position to return some of my "experience". So here are my observations on what seems a very familiar situation. Condenser, condenser condenser. They cost nothing and take 5minutes to swap but do cause very similar symptoms. BUT as already pointed out there are faulty ones floating about which caused a 6 month headache for me.

However, all this fettling and tweaking over a period of weeks can (as pointed out already) foul up the spark plugs and cause one to think your problem still exists even when you have solved it by replacing the condenser, all be it one that works.

Which brings me to another possible "overlapping" problem of the ignition barrel. This at best will be 40 years old and maybe hasn't been used for 10 years and now is being used repeatedly while you work through the problem. So your already worn barrel may now be verging on the terminal and at best intermittent - as was the case with mine. Generator light shows on the dash, engine turns over but doesn't fire. Lots of cursing and swapping condenser, cleaning plugs etc get back in and it fires up - problem solved with the new/faulty condenser or was it the cleaned plugs? Take her for a spin - perfect. Next day turn on, generator light on - won't fire up.

Omicron suggested a new ignition barrel and key - problem solved. It also solved an ongoing two year problem I had with the engine cutting out every time you used the left indicator. I may be way off the mark - just a thought - might help. Good luck.

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andyps
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« Reply #17 on: 29 September, 2020, 07:46:01 PM »

Thanks for the suggestion of the ignition switch, it has been mentioned before so definitely next to look at if the other things go nowhere. I'm sure the connections to it would benefit from being cleaned up if nothing else.
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nistri
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« Reply #18 on: 30 September, 2020, 08:03:36 AM »

Condenser: beware of condensers that don't show make and rating (0.25 microF) on their surface, Andrea
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Andrea Nistri

Ardea S2
Appia S2
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Fulvia Sport 1.3 S
Fulvia Montecarlo
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Jaydub
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« Reply #19 on: 30 September, 2020, 11:28:56 AM »

Andy,  I agree with the comments about eliminating possible condenser failure. However,  you do not need to worry about the microfarad value of the condenser if you use a competition condenser from Swiftune Engineering in Kent. I have no connection to them but having used their condensers for many years on countless race engines with contact breaker ignitions, I have never heard of a failure! They aren`t cheap at around 30.00 inc vat but you will have complete reliability from them, so cheaper in the long run.
 You fit one connection directly to the contact breaker side of the coil and the other side to the coil mounting bracket as an earth. Remove the one in the distributor as it`s not needed and that is the worst environment for a condenser anyway with heat and vibration. If you opt for a cheaper reproduction type, mount it to the coil as I suggested, it will help it to survive.
Good luck.
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andyps
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« Reply #20 on: 30 September, 2020, 08:12:12 PM »

Andy,  I agree with the comments about eliminating possible condenser failure. However,  you do not need to worry about the microfarad value of the condenser if you use a competition condenser from Swiftune Engineering in Kent. I have no connection to them but having used their condensers for many years on countless race engines with contact breaker ignitions, I have never heard of a failure! They aren`t cheap at around 30.00 inc vat but you will have complete reliability from them, so cheaper in the long run.
 You fit one connection directly to the contact breaker side of the coil and the other side to the coil mounting bracket as an earth. Remove the one in the distributor as it`s not needed and that is the worst environment for a condenser anyway with heat and vibration. If you opt for a cheaper reproduction type, mount it to the coil as I suggested, it will help it to survive.
Good luck.

Thanks, that is a route I hadn't come across before. For that cost it is worth doing too, I'll get in touch with Switune tomorrow.
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chriswgawne
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« Reply #21 on: 01 October, 2020, 08:16:06 AM »

Echoing Tim's earlier post, I always use NGK spark plugs and also NKG plug caps where appropriate such as Aurelia.
I have never had a faulty NGK item.
Chris
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Chris Gawne
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fay66
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« Reply #22 on: 01 October, 2020, 10:05:38 AM »

Echoing Tim's earlier post, I always use NGK spark plugs and also NKG plug caps where appropriate such as Aurelia.
I have never had a faulty NGK item.
Chris
To echo Tim and Chris, I've been using ngk plugs for over 20 years in my Fulvia 2c, and in many other cars over the last 40?years with no problems.
I've always kept a clean set handy as if you do overchoke and foul a plug it's a waste of time cleaning it if you have another handy.
I went over to NGK platinum plugs last year as I was having a fouling problem, these seem to have overcome the problem but it's early days yet.
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Own 1966 Fulvia 2C Berlina since 1997, back on road 11-1999.Known as "Fay"
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fay66
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« Reply #23 on: 01 October, 2020, 10:11:48 AM »

Echoing Tim's earlier post, I always use NGK spark plugs and also NKG plug caps where appropriate such as Aurelia.
I have never had a faulty NGK item.
Chris
To echo Tim and Chris, I've been using ngk plugs for over 20 years in my Fulvia 2c, and in many other cars over the last 40?years with no problems.
I've always kept a clean set handy, as if you do over choke and foul a plug it's a waste of time cleaning it if you have another handy.
I went over to NGK platinum plugs last year as I was having a fouling problem, these seem to have overcome the problem but it's early days yet.
I also fitted a Sparkrite 400? Electronic ignition unit that just uses the points as a trigger, I previously had one made from a Maplins kit by my friend the late Bob Seaney, that ran well for many years and ran for a  number of years before in his wife's Fulvia, I last changed the points 15 years ago!
Brian
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1999 Suzuki Wagon R+ GL, now my daughters
2006 Renault Megane 1 5 Dci Sports Tourer
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Charles Frodsham
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« Reply #24 on: 01 October, 2020, 01:49:39 PM »

I use NGK plugs on all my cars.

However, there seems to be a failure mechanism when they are approximately a year old ( hence I change them every year), and once fouled they will not be coaxed back to life however well they are cleaned. This is not just my experience as I have heard similar stories.

Great plugs......but change them every year!
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andyps
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« Reply #25 on: 01 October, 2020, 02:30:25 PM »

I use NGK plugs on all my cars.

However, there seems to be a failure mechanism when they are approximately a year old ( hence I change them every year), and once fouled they will not be coaxed back to life however well they are cleaned. This is not just my experience as I have heard similar stories.

Great plugs......but change them every year!

I read recently (in the report of one of the contributors cars in Octane magazine I think) that it is modern fuels that mean that once a plug has been fouled and left they won't work again.

I got a new set of plugs from Omicron yesterday but haven't opened it yet, can't remember what brand they recommended.
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lancialulu
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« Reply #26 on: 01 October, 2020, 06:08:31 PM »

I use NGK plugs on all my cars.

However, there seems to be a failure mechanism when they are approximately a year old ( hence I change them every year), and once fouled they will not be coaxed back to life however well they are cleaned. This is not just my experience as I have heard similar stories.

Great plugs......but change them every year!
I cannot say this is my experience..... I have heard that maybe modern fuels glaze the the tip so the the spark tracks and I cannot remember the remedy but it has not been a problem for me. Cant remember when I last bought a set of plugs and I run 8 Lancias....
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Its not the winning but taking part! or is it taking apart?
1955 Aurelia B12
1967 Flavia Vignale iniezione
1967 Fulvia 1.3HFR
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 Fulvia 1600HF
1972 1600 Fulvia Sport
1979 2500 Gamma Coupe
1988 Delta 1.6GTi
1998 Zeta
Neil
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« Reply #27 on: 01 October, 2020, 07:41:44 PM »

Try NGK Iridium plugs, a bit more expensive seem pretty to reliable with my 1.3.
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Neil   
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fay66
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« Reply #28 on: 01 October, 2020, 08:56:18 PM »

Try NGK Iridium plugs, a bit more expensive seem pretty to reliable with my 1.3.
Sorry, I said I fitted platinum plugs, in fact as Neil says here they were NGK Iridium.
Brian
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Own 1966 Fulvia 2C Berlina since 1997, back on road 11-1999.Known as "Fay"
1999 Suzuki Wagon R+ GL, now my daughters
2006 Renault Megane 1 5 Dci Sports Tourer
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andyps
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« Reply #29 on: 01 October, 2020, 10:44:39 PM »

I'd already got one plug out so I could see if it was sparking so I changed it for a new plug tonight and there is a spark, but not with the old one. It was a bit late in the day to try starting it so that might have to wait until Saturday but definite progress. Competition condenser ordered from Swiftune which should arrive Saturday.

Still need to sort an earth strap from the gearbox bellhousing to the subframe but can make something up for that. Hopefully might start and run reliably soon!
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