Lancia Motor Club

I am re-reading the Inspector Morse novels as a cure for insomnia and have always known that the learned gent drove a Lancia rather than the Jaguar ..... but which one ?

In his first novel,  published in 1975, Colin Dexter described Morse's car as "The faithful old Lancia ..... It had been a good buy. Powerful, reliable , and 300 miles on a full tank."

I have always imagined it as a Flaminia , probably  a PF Coupé ... but who knows ?

Flavia ? Aurelia ??? Lambda ( his garage was too small) ?

Given the TV series had a Jag it could be a B20??

I seem to remember reading somewhere that it was a Flavia. I also remember reading a quote by Colin Dexter when he heard that Morse would be driving a Jag in the TV series. He said 'Morse wouldn't be seen dead in a Jag!'. The thing that's always puzzled me, bearing in mind the TV Morse at least (haven't read the books) is a bit of a connoiseur of fine things, is why they lumbered him with that terrible car with a vinyl roof? I read it was a Daimler converted to a Jag, which is neither here nor there but I have never, ever seen another Mk 2 with a vinyl roof. Has anybody else?

The famous Coombs modified Jaguar Mk2 road cars were distinguishable by their vinyl roofs.

Forty Nine Pounds and 10 Shillings

On my crore Escort 1300E it was standard, and my Capri 3litre

Well, never knew that. Still can't remember seeing a Coombs Jag with one either, but there you are. Yep, my Daytona Yellow Mk III Cortina had one too.................................well, I was young and it was affordable.

To return to the original question ...........  I know !

Confirmed by the great man himself, but I don't think I'll tell you just yet.

When I organised our Silverstone stand I was going to run a little competition for a free ticket but never got round to it, so, just for fun, I wonder who will get exactly the right car, spec and colour ?

Martin.

I'll stick to my original Flaminia pf coupe - dark blue

If it's Morse it has to be tasteful. So I'm going for a dark blue Flavia coupe, 1500 cc so it doesn't cost him too much in fuel!

Dark blue B12.

David

My money is on a Lancia Flavia 2000 Berlina in grey.

Bi-colour Flaminia sedan in black and silver.  2.5l.

A four door model perhaps? According to the Inspector Morse Society, the details of the model can be found in the books.On one occasion the Inspector is pleased with  "300 to the tankfull"(as mentioned earlier in the thread). That is the only clue I have,so does this MPG value eliminate any of the larger capacity Lancias? "Fiat-Lancia" is suggested elsewhere.  

Been doing some research Richard ?

It is definitely a Flavia and I would doubt a coupe, but maybe a Vignale???? Money on Berlina 2000 as the books claim the car to be "powerful". Could be your London Sport David......

More time than money! Is the model specified in the books or is that a "red herring"? Is Colin Dexter a Lancia fan?

Is Flavia mentioned in the books?

Colin Dexter is known not to know much about cars, and a friend suggested the Lancia (Flavia). ;D

don't know about largercapacity Lancias, but it certainly rules out Fulvia Berlina, 180 miles and I'm beginning to get paranoid ::)

brian
8227 8)

In the second book, Morse "puts his seatbelt on" so probably rules out Aurelias and my Flaminia as well .....

Martin, time to spill the beans ??

There are two questions here; i. knowing Morse as we do, what car would he choose? ii. what car did Colin Dexter choose for him?  The 1st book came out in 1975 which fits well with him driving a Flaminia - quite old by then but not "elderely".  It's big and powerful and to my mind the PF coupe is exactly what he would have chosen - in dark blue I think.  The understated but beautiful styling, the quality and the ingenuity are all features that he would have admired. And then there is it's idiosyncratic nature and sheer "Italianess"!  The fuel tank holds 12.5 gallons and so it would just be possible to get 300 miles from a tankful which would make it worth commenting on when this was achieved.  Of course, as a serving policeman he would had the seat belts fitted.  So I reckon the answer to i. is Flaminia.  But what about ii.?  As an author that didn't know hat much about cars I think that Colin Dexter would have looked to meet many of the qualities above but I suspect that his advisers would probably have steered him past the Flaminia as being a bit too old by then and I think that the Flavia is in the spotlight.  Curiously, I don't think it would have been one of the coupes; I'm more drawn to a berlina because of the quiet sophistication coupled again with quality and understated looks. I think that 1500cc would not have been enough and 2000cc brings us too far into the Fiat era so I go for 1800cc.  The 815 would have been getting a bit old by 1975 so I think the 819 - and 300 miles on a tankful would be quite easily achieved.  So, for me Morse (the character) would have chosen the Flaminia PF coupe in dark blue.  I suspect, however, that Colin Dexter would have chosen a Flavia 819 in dark blue for him.

Charles,
I loved your process of deduction and elimination, no doubt Morse would have done something similar :D

Brian
8227 8)

Another change between the books and the TV was that the original Morse was a wine buff not a real ale enthusiast. That with the opera would suggest an enthusiasm for things Italian so Colin Dexter probably asked someone to suggest a suitably sophisticated Italian car.

I have always felt a Flavia most likely without really being able to say why.

Frank

Yes probably time to spill the beans but I am so enjoying this !!! and so much academic analysis, very impressive.

Don't want to string it out (actually I do) but one of you in particular is incredibly close, but not the way you might think !!!!!

Martin.

We had the Herts and Beds Christmas dinner last night. Martin and Libby confirmed that they have confirmation of the precise model directly from Colin Dexter himself. So the question is not "what Lancia did Morse drive" but "what exactly do we have to do to get the answere out of Martin"?

Well, it's 2014 now. Must be time to gather everyone in the library to reveal the culprit.

Well its now 2015!!!!!!

Martin please let me know I was right!

Tim

My money would be on a gunmetal or 'blu Lancia' Flavia 1800 or 2000 berlina. I had always thought a Flam until I saw the quote about 300 miles to the tankful (in your dreams, with a Flam). But in that case it has to be a Flavia 1.8 or 2000 berlina - the 50s cars would be too old, the 1500 is too slow, the coupés not dignified enough, and the colours choose themselves.

I have always though the choice of a Mk2 Jag for the TV prog showed what a low state the Beeb was in at the time (actually even worse now...) - wrong colour, vinyl roof was because it was a write-off bought cheaply from a scrapyard (whatever Peter says!), and most of all, wrong kind of car.

In the 70s Mk2 Jags had NO image, and were driven by thugs, petty crooks and bank robbers (on TV and in real life), simply because they were fast, common and cheap (not the ideal car for Morse then!). The idea of someone who loved opera and the finer things in life driving one back then would have been completely preposterous and just shows that the Beeb will have sent some spotty 22-year-old, who knew sod all about cars and cared less, down the nearest scrapyard to White City with £150, which was par for the course for them both then and now (cf. Top Gear). A Lancia as specified by Colin Dexter, however, was right on the money for the character.

What a shame the Beeb had to go and dumb it down. A shame, but not a surprise.

Thanks for that too - I didn't know that, and always thought that beer sat oddly with opera. Flavias (or Flams... waiting agog for the verdict!), opera and fine wine all belong together, but opera, Jags and beer don't!!

Typical Beeb populism (again!).

I just re-read this thread and thought about the 1975 publication date for the first book.

So going a bit off piste here, Morse was a chief inspector, he lived in a flat in an old house which I don't think would have been enormously expensive back then, but he indulged himself with the finer things in life. That would mean he was quite well paid, with low outgoings but having to drive around Oxfordshire for work might he not have gone for a new car. Is the old car idea another BBC invention? Also Lewis had to take Morse's car out once and remarked on its' performance.

So here's a guess for the Beta Boys.........a dark blue Beta Sedan. Elegant in a modern way, still quite special in the early seventies before rust (or was it Esther Rantzen and the daily Hate Mail ) tarnished its' reputation and performance worth remarking on.

Now somebody will tell me that the books say it was an old  car and spoil my idea.

Frank

Alan, it was ITV not The BBC who made the series and broadcast them over the years.

Oops! Mind you, they were even worse! I particularly hate the Beeb though, because I wrote things for them 3 times, and none of the experiences was in any way positive!

Being brought up in the East End in the 60's if someone had a Mk II Jag we would say he has a 'bank robbers Jag'.

Exactly - Mk2s were more Kray twins than Inspector Morse!

I saw a documentary featuring one of the drivers from the Great train Robbery (the drivers were lads who fancied themselves a bit as racing drivers rather than hardened criminals) he said what they really wanted was Aurelias but the Ford Cortina Lotus' were more available.

Crooks with taste!