Lancia Motor Club

I've just read (Carscoop) that Audi has been in discussions with FIAT and rumour has it that the topic of conversation is the acquisition by Audi of Alfa Romeo.  This has been mentioned before and has to date come to nothing, but recently journalists have been given reason to speculate once more.  Hmmmmm  ::)

Hearsay or not, IF Audi did acquire Alfa wouldn't that leave the FIAT group with a gap to fill.  Wouldn't they need to provide something of a perceived higher calibre than a FIAT and a more affordable car than a Maserati?  Wouldn't they have a gap where they once had a sporty product for the masses?  Wouldn't they need a brand with a certain caché and sporting & technical excellence?  Wouldn't Lancia be the obvious answer?

Obviously this question relies on two big IFs... 1) that Audi are actually trying to buy Alfa, and 2) that Marchionne actually gives a flip about Lancia!   :-\

That would be a result, but its a long way back to its esteemed position in the world of high quality cars, , it would need a hefty investment to give it back its identity/quality image...........fingers Xed theres a silver lining to said sale, if it happens


P

A long way indeed... just watched the Lord Of The Rings Trilogy and I'm minded to think that the task ahead for Lancia would be comparable!  :o

Shoot me down but how about Audi buying Lancia instead of Alfa Romeo ? Just an idea.

Well it didn't do Lamborghini any harm did it  ;D

Faced with a slow and undignified death by Marchionne, or forever being associated with re-badged Chryslers perhaps being bought by Audi might not be such a bad idea.  I'd be happy to walk into an Audi/ Lancia showroom some time soon and choose between the latest Audi S4 and Lancia S4  ::) (no contest)

The only thing is that Audi also aim at that sector of the market....high end, quality saloons.....it would make more sense for them to go for Alfa....complete the suite

P

Agreed.

But we all know that Lancia has more sporting pedigree than our cousin.

Ho hum... meanwhile we shall just have to suffer humiliation that is Chrancia.

[Hey, combining CHRYSLER with LANCIA actually looks like a real word... I reckon it is Latin for 'mediocre'  ;)]

Or more like a derivation of  the  word chancre.......a nasty abnormal growth.....

 ::)


P

This rumour has been rumbling around for a long time so one can either view it rather like a persistent but untrue viral e-mail, or something which has some truth in it simply because it is so persistent.  If Alfa did move to the VW Group stable, the obvious casualty would presumably be Seat, who have long been positioned (albeit with limited success, despite the cars being pretty good) as the sporting brand in the stable.

Interestingly, here in Australia (where we don't have Seats...) Fiat and Alfa have just cut their prices substantially, and are talking about 'repositioning' their brands, which were pitched as premium market products (Fiat only import the 500 here), and expanding the model ranges and sales.  This means that the 500 is now selling for supermini money, and the cheapest Giulietta (a relatively well equipped 1.4 turbo) comes in at the same price as a mid-range Golf - rather than pitching itself up against Audis and BMWs (which are really pricey here).  The range of cars at the moment is limited to the 500, Mito and Giulietta (the 159 was quietly dropped a while ago, but was painfully expensive), but there are plans to (re)introduce the Punto, and bring in the new Panda, as well as new 500 derivatives.  I imagine new SUVs would sell here too.  The same guy responsible for Jeep's renaissance here (mind, you can buy a Patriot for the equivalent of £12,500 - about A$25,000, so at that price point it becomes attractive enough to overlook its many limitations) is in charge of this operation for Fiat/Alfa, so expectations of doubled sales (albeit from a very small base) are not too fanciful.

Strangely, the press release indicated that they would consider any model for RHD (and hence Aussie sales), ignoring the fact that most models in both ranges are already in RHD for other markets, and that the barrier to importation is not the engineering, but an assessment of whether a model will sell in sufficient numbers over here.  Frankly, anything to dilute the ubiquity of Japanese and Korean cars over here would be good.

On the initial point of the post, I confess I am sceptical that Fiat would develop Lancia as an alternative to Alfa.  If they sell Alfa, it will in effect be an admission that they cannot compete in that segment of the market, and are, in effect, withdrawing.  To then invest the time and resources into developing a less well known brand as a replacement seems to me unlikely - but at the same time I can't see Fiat willingly withdrawing from the mid-market that Alfa represents, so I can only see Alfa going to VW/Audi as a 'fire sale' act of desperation.  Be careful what you wish for, because the sale of Alfa could presage the end of independent volume Italian car manufacturing.

Today, on Carscoop...

Recent developments suggest there could be more than just rumors to the supposed sale of Alfa Romeo to the VW Group. Following a report late last month saying Fiat and VW are negotiating a sale of Alfa Romeo and the Pomigliano d’Arco assembly plant, news broke out today from Europa Magazine that Volkswagen and Audi experts visited… the Pomigliano plant near Naples, in southern Italy.
Fiat spokesman Franco Sodano told German news agency DPA that experts working on the assembly of the VW Up city car and the Audi Q7 SUV were visiting the Pomigliano facility as part of a “routine” exercise in sharing industry best practices. As expected, Fiat quickly denied that the visit had anything to do with media rumors about a possible deal between the two companies.

However, the visit seems quite curious. While it is true that the retooled Pomigliano plant is a state-of-the-art facility, we have to confess we haven’t heard that often about rival manufacturers routinely sending delegations to visit competing plants in order to improve their manufacturing practices.

The Pomigliano facility now builds the Fiat Panda city car, but in the past, it was Alfa Romeo’s main plant. Pomigliano was awarded the Automotive Lean Production prize last year by a panel selected by German trade magazine Automobil Produktion.

But wait, there’s more to this story. According to Italy's news agency ANSA, the Pomigliano plant was also visited today by a delegation from Fiat’s Kragujevac plant in Serbia, where the 500L is made. The million-dollar question is what were these people doing at the Panda plant the same day it was visited by the VW delegation? Could Fiat consider a transfer of the Panda production to Serbia in case VW buys Pomigliano?

We don’t know the answer to this question yet, but the plot may be getting thicker now with these new developments, don’t you think?

I think it is time we admitted that Lancia is dead and has been for some time.     It is now just a name, a hollow shell and not even a badge, the latest effort easily confused with that of a Dacia.   The Dacia might even be a better car than the present crop of badge engineered Japanese, FIAT and, God forbid, Chrysler offerings.  A marque that was once distinguished by being at least 20 years ahead of the rest has no business being associated with the USA from which I am unable to think of an innovation in motor car design.   Very few cars nowadays have anything much individual about them anyway.    Audi/VW/Skoda/Seat - all badges on the same basic platform with a few differences in trim or tune.  ~What is to say that a "Lancia" would be any different no matter who owned the badge.
Lancia is dead.  Long live Lancia!

Agreed David, little point in hankering after those halcyon days of innovation and automotive excellence. A number nails were driven into the coffin Lancia over 50 odd years.....the lid was closed when FIAT took over and more recently the screws tightened to their maximum torque settings when the Chrysler tie up took place. May Lancia rest in peace.

Long live Lancia!!!..........Long live the LMC!!!!


P

The rumoured VW/Audi visit to Naples seems to relate to small car production (Up, Citygo etc.), still a fairly new area for them as far as modern designs go. It seems a big leap to turn a visit to the Panda production line to the purchase of Alpha Romeo?!

Nothings changed. Individuality today unless its top end expensive stuff like Lancia was in its heyday has always been an acquired taste and innovation unless you are prepared to pay for it is much of a muchness everywhere in this computer generated era.

Take the Thesis or a Citroen C6 against the Audi/BMW/Jaguar/Lexus/Mercedes of this world and add their overall sales together and combined it would be less than 15% of any one of the others which offer bland boring motoring yet have an alleged reputation for build quality, durability and resale value. There is nothing wrong with the Lancia or Citroen other than that they are probably too clever and too individual for their own good, yet simply because they are Italian or French they are deemed unreliable and a poor investment. I would personally choose one over their German & Japanese competitors every time.

 I love my Thesis and use it everyday covering approx 700 km weekly and it has been more reliable and economical than previous Audi's & BMW that I have owned and for me stands for everything that Lancia has always stood for despite little innovation but definitely bucket loads of individuality. It cost me slightly over £14,000 14 months & 45,000 km ago yet is still worth £12,000 in the UK (this is what I was offered for it at Event City over the weekend- it is not for sale) so actually holds its value over here better than the others and remains an undiscovered gem.

 I cannot afford a Lancia that was 20 years ahead of its time so for me my Thesis has to do and it ticks all the boxes- end off!

I, however agree you are right  regarding the current crop of cars (Delta excepted but now old hat so no longer competitive) based on Fiat and Chrysler platforms, there is nothing to recommend and no linkage to heritage or tradition.

Hi Paul, Event City was the first time I've had a chance to close and personal with a Thesis whilst Stan had the keys in his custody. I've yet to see a photograph that does the car justice but it's stunning inside and out. When the Punto reaches the end of the line for me I'll consider a Thesis despite the LHD limitation.

Loved it, want one!

Guy

Guy,

Paul Baker is selling his, listed here on the forum under sales. Slipped to page 2 or 3 for some reason.
Flog the Punto now, everyone's got one of those !

Martin.

Glad to be of service Guy, LHD isn't really a limitation unless you use lots of car parks/tolls/barrier systems.

Thanks for the encouragement chaps, just need finances! The Punto is probably worth 1/3rd of the asking price of the Thesis and I can't bridge that gap at the moment! Unless anyone out there thinks a bright orange 1.9 Multijet with 40k and FSH is worth a LOT more than I think it is!

Lottery ticket at the weekend!

GUy