Lancia Motor Club

Model Technical and Interest => Dedra, Thema and Delta (2nd series) => Topic started by: Kevinlincs on 29 January, 2020, 09:43:39 PM



Title: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 29 January, 2020, 09:43:39 PM
I've been pointed towards a Dedra turbo L148 SWS that is offered sale as a restoration project, hasn't been tested for a few years but not an age, condition from the pictures I've been sent shows rusty rear arches and front strut top towers, a few dents but interior looks decent.
I'd like to save it, had a very nice white 1.8 years ago followed by a red turbo, which my friend Jim still owns.

Does anybody know anything of L148?
A car like that would surely have been owned by a club member at some point...


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 29 January, 2020, 11:38:44 PM
I've been pointed towards a Dedra turbo L148 SWS that is offered sale as a restoration project, hasn't been tested for a few years but not an age, condition from the pictures I've been sent shows rusty rear arches and front strut top towers, a few dents but interior looks decent.
I'd like to save it, had a very nice white 1.8 years ago followed by a red turbo, which my friend Jim still owns.

Does anybody know anything of L148?
A car like that would surely have been owned by a club member at some point...
Hi Kevin,
I'll have to check my old records or photos, as I think it might have belonged to Stuart Harvey from Norwich.
Stuart has always been a very fastidious owner who always had things done correctly.
What colour is it.
If you do get it I have still got my Dedra Manuals etc, but much of it is on load to Richard Carr who bought the ex Chris Hopkins Dedra integrale.
I'll have a look tomorrow.
Brian
8227  8)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 29 January, 2020, 11:47:51 PM
Also the rear wings are readily detachable, even though it doesn't look like it, so that helps with repairs.


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 29 January, 2020, 11:52:52 PM
I've been pointed towards a Dedra turbo L148 SWS that is offered sale as a restoration project, hasn't been tested for a few years but not an age, condition from the pictures I've been sent shows rusty rear arches and front strut top towers, a few dents but interior looks decent.
I'd like to save it, had a very nice white 1.8 years ago followed by a red turbo, which my friend Jim still owns.

Does anybody know anything of L148?
A car like that would surely have been owned by a club member at some point...
Hi Kevin,
I'll have to check my old records or photos, as I think it might have belonged to Stuart Harvey from Norwich.
Stuart has always been a very fastidious owner who always had things done correctly.
What colour is it.
If you do get it I have still got my Dedra Manuals etc, but much of it is on load to Richard Carr who bought the ex Chris Hopkins Dedra integrale.
I'll have a look tomorrow.
Brian
8227  8)

The car is black Brian, in the Norfolk area still so more than feasible that it could be that one...


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 29 January, 2020, 11:58:53 PM
Also the rear wings are readily detachable, even though it doesn't look like it, so that helps with repairs.

I'd noticed they had cap screws on the Dedras' I'd has Frank, guessing they'll also be bonded on?
Good idea about removing them if possible.
I welded up an Alfa 155 last year which had gone similarly, basically the same car as I'm sure you know, the water had gotten into the seam sealer and rotted the steel so much the whole inner wheel arch was detached from the boot floor all along both sides. By the look of the pictures this Dedra won't be any better!

Always had a soft spot for the Dedra, very much under-rated car in my mind. Be great to have another even if it means more work  ;D


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 30 January, 2020, 10:33:12 AM
Also the rear wings are readily detachable, even though it doesn't look like it, so that helps with repairs.

I'd noticed they had cap screws on the Dedras' I'd has Frank, guessing they'll also be bonded on?
Good idea about removing them if possible.
I welded up an Alfa 155 last year which had gone similarly, basically the same car as I'm sure you know, the water had gotten into the seam sealer and rotted the steel so much the whole inner wheel arch was detached from the boot floor all along both sides. By the look of the pictures this Dedra won't be any better!

Always had a soft spot for the Dedra, very much under-rated car in my mind. Be great to have another even if it means more work  ;D
Despite what the workshop manual says you can remove rear wings without taking out the rear window.
It should have a sunroof and the rear drain tubes get misplaced so the water runs into thrle boot, hence the floors rotting out.
Brian
8227  8)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 30 January, 2020, 01:32:01 PM
Evidence or rear wing removability.


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: lancialulu on 30 January, 2020, 02:00:24 PM
that reg is not know to the club


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 30 January, 2020, 10:24:47 PM
Evidence or rear wing removability.

That's certainly proof it will come off Frank, is it removable without damaging it?

Going to view the car on Saturday, which as we all know "view" means "buy"  ;D Despite the known issues It'd need to have something else seriously wrong for me not to buy it...  

Like when I got the Y10, it's the thrill of saving a car from the brink of becoming lost forever. Not that the Y10 was that bad, but the Dedra has so far eluded being broken for spares, especially to donate its' engine...


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 31 January, 2020, 12:05:22 AM
that reg is not know to the club
Tim,
In 2017 I tried to assist a new forum member with his query regarding parts for the ex Stuart Harvey car, the new owner had been informed that Stuart had owned it, after he bought it off eBay, he did however say when he bought it it had been off the road since 2008, and that he wanted to restore it, but as he hasn't been a forum member since 2017, so it seems he probably had a change of mind.
Just off to search my pc for old photos of it to confirm it's the same vehicle.
Brian
8227  8)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 31 January, 2020, 10:20:34 AM
No damage in removing and replacing. This one had suffered a bang from a stone wall after slipping on tricky ice. It was basically a spanner job and not complicated. I can even put you in touch with the chap that did it if you want reassurance.


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: eog on 31 January, 2020, 11:27:31 AM
Just had a look at MOT history, while it has had advisory notes no fails, all pass from March 2007 to 2013.
Mileage over this time 118500 to 139000

Last MOT details

Date tested
3 April 2013
Pass
Mileage
139,028 miles
MOT test number
6550 1319 3021
Test location
► View test location
Expiry date
2 April 2014
Advisory notice item(s)
Nearside Inner Front constant velocity joint gaiter deteriorated, but preventing the ingress of dirt (2.5.C.1a)
Offside Outer Front constant velocity joint gaiter deteriorated, but preventing the ingress of dirt (2.5.C.1a)
Nearside Front Suspension arm rubber bush deteriorated but not resulting in excessive movement (2.4.G.2)
Parking brake: parking brake efficiency only just met. It would appear that the braking system requires adjustment or repair. (3.7.B.7)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 31 January, 2020, 12:29:26 PM
There's nothing to worry about there. On a car with that performance you would want to go through the running gear thoroughly after a lay up anyway. The Thema Dedra Consortium  (TDC) will be useful for advice and parts. A Dedra really is a lovely car to drive and ride in so well worth the effort to keep one alive.


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 31 January, 2020, 09:33:35 PM
Yes, I'd searched the MoT history and nothing to worry about there. It has obviously deteriorated in the rear arch area which as we know is very common on the Dedra/Alfa 155 so I know what's to come there. Off to see it tomorrow afternoon so I'll soon know...

I'll also be able to find out more on previous owners from the documentation.

Very interesting that the rear quarter can be removed without damage Frank, I'd seen the various cap head bolts scattered all around it so assumed they were fasteners for it, just always assumed there was some spot welds or bonding sealant elsewhere.  Don't suppose that rear quarter is for sale  ;D


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 31 January, 2020, 10:43:21 PM
I'm afraid not. That was the replacement rear quarter that went back on the car. Also it was probably a decade ago.


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 31 January, 2020, 11:38:05 PM
I'm afraid not. That was the replacement rear quarter that went back on the car. Also it was probably a decade ago.

 ;D shame


Car is advertised as a turbo SE, what extra bits should the SE have?
Would it have the electronic suspension maybe? ABS is present, I can see that in one picture.

Heater control panel and dash layout appear the same as my old turbo, wouldn't the electronic suspension have a different control panel somewhere?


Just checked the Dedra brochure I have, seems the suspension controls would be just below the heater climate control panel, not apparent in the small picture I was sent so probably not an SE?


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 01 February, 2020, 01:47:11 AM
Kervin,
Finally found the photo of Stuarts Turbo I was looking for,sorry but this is not it, his was L144 SWS.
But I've sent you some other photos and information.
Brian
8227 8)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 01 February, 2020, 06:49:09 PM
I have been told that SE isn't a specific set of parts but that sounds a bit iffy. Perhaps there was some specific kit but individual importers or dealers upgraded the spec. Mine had electric seats, electric heat seaters, switchable suspension, electric door mirrors, headlamp washers and wipers, electric rear windows plus maybe bits I can't remember.


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 01 February, 2020, 08:35:37 PM
Well, I went and saw it, but didn't buy it.
It's in a saveable condition if anyone else is interested in it.
Both bumpers are hanging off at the ends due to the mounts rotted away, particularly the rear.
Passenger rear door has been damaged badly which has led to the bottom of it rotting out.
Drivers front wing is damaged at the front half, breaking the indicator.
Sunroof has been leaking as the roof lining and pillar trim is covered in mould.
Sill to floor edges will need work, probably the outer sills too once the skirts removed.
All around the boot floor where it joins the inner wheel wells is corroded, some having been patched before.
Seats aren't bad, not ripped or holed but will need a shave to get rid of the alcantara bobbling! Central armrest a bit threadbare.
No battery on it so couldn't test any electrics let alone start the engine, guy assures me he has had it started and no knocks or bangs....make your own mind up on that.
Other body panels are in decent enough shape, paint obviously faded but may come back.
As it has been off the road since around 2013 it looks to have been stored outside, whole under-bonnet area full of debris, possibly rodent applied!
Wheels look decent but painted rather than diamond cut, very presentable for that though.

For me it was too much of a risk, the unknown condition of stuff like the engine/gearbox/brakes especially given the ABS plus all the welding repairs needed, with the inevitable repairs so far unseen put me off.
As I say though it has the basics so could be saved, one door, a wing and some hard work with the welder and it'd be there or thereabouts. I've enough on my plate at the moment so for once I listened to the common sense voice!

If anyone is interested the guy seems genuine enough, James on 07445 314489, car is on the outskirts of Ipswich.
He did say he's had a lot of interest in parts off it but would rather sell the car complete so it's saved, fair play to him for that.

Wants 800 for it.

Make your mind up if that's cheap or expensive, but when was the last one offered for sale?

I'll post the pictures he sent me from my phone...


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 01 February, 2020, 08:41:36 PM
First ones


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 01 February, 2020, 08:48:12 PM
Rear shots


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 01 February, 2020, 08:49:37 PM
Interior


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 01 February, 2020, 08:50:52 PM
Rear Seats


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 02 February, 2020, 01:33:25 AM
Kevin,
To be honest for what's being asked, not a lot more will buy you a decent LHD one from Holland.
I thought the asking price was a bit optomistic!
BRIAN
8227  8)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Kevinlincs on 02 February, 2020, 11:03:20 AM
The price I thought was a bit high too Brian but the guy was fairly firm on it, judging it for what he'd get in parts I think.
I still went to have a look at it incase the hens teeth situation arrived where it was better than it looked!


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 02 February, 2020, 12:05:12 PM
From what you say it is probably a parts car because they are worth more than the whole. I found details of SE spec in an old brochure and it comes down to ABS, split rear seats, electric rear windows and electrically heated and adjusted front seats. Automatic suspension control seems to be on 2.0ie and SE models. I suspect what is standard, what is special and what is an extra changes over time as model designations change. Here are some tables from the brochures.


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 02 February, 2020, 09:53:05 PM
From what you say it is probably a parts car because they are worth more than the whole. I found details of SE spec in an old brochure and it comes down to ABS, split rear seats, electric rear windows and electrically heated and adjusted front seats. Automatic suspension control seems to be on 2.0ie and SE models. I suspect what is standard, what is special and what is an extra changes over time as model designations change. Here are some tables from the brochures.
Considering how few Dedra's are left I can't see them being of vast value, few hundred quid more and you could get a nice LHD from The Netherlands for that, so looking at the condition, I can't see a great deal worth buying if the trim has been exposed to the wet, headlights would be worth having as no RHD ones have been available for years.
Besides which I'm sure members of TDC still have a good stock of many items in their storage.
 My first Dedra was a 2.o. iese, and they certainly did vary in what you got.
Mine had the electronic suspension, but 385 a corner to replace, but didn't have the electric seats, they should have 4 electric windows and remote central locking, I also had the headlamp wipers that were useless and used to wave at me over the edge of the bonnet, all the 2.o Iese  had the electronic heater controls, sometimes referred to as climate control incorrectly as aircon was never an option in the UK.
Can you please try and repost the right way up
😊
Brian
8227
 8)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: peteracs on 03 February, 2020, 09:27:38 AM
Hi Brian

Replaced with correct way up.

Peter


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Angle Grinder on 28 February, 2020, 02:57:07 PM
I can't make promises, but from memory, I think the Thema Dedra Consortium could supply rust free examples of all the panels that are needed for that car.



Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 29 February, 2020, 08:37:56 PM
Hi Brian

Replaced with correct way up.

Peter
Thanks Peter👍
Brian


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: Duncan23 on 14 October, 2020, 03:07:54 PM
Interesting car. I had a sibling Dedra Turbo - L138 SWS between 2011 and 2013. I swapped it for a Multipla because I needed a hatch, but it was one of the best cars I've had.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/5003/5352671678_d7e7b6a1ab_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/99ZQNJ)dedra rhs (https://flic.kr/p/99ZQNJ) by duncancmartin (https://www.flickr.com/photos/90461577@N00/), on Flickr
The MOT expired in 2017, hopefully it ended up in a barn somewhere and will re-appear, but I doubt it. :(


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: mikeC on 18 October, 2020, 07:43:09 AM
Looks like there was a whole fleet of them: L119SWS to L149SWS were all 2-litre Dedras!


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 18 October, 2020, 12:16:25 PM
Might those have been the Dedra Challenge cars?


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: fay66 on 18 October, 2020, 06:01:56 PM
Might those have been the Dedra Challenge

I thought the Debra Challenge was about 1989/1990, but I've since found out that my black Debra K452 PLK was a Debra Challenge car, so I suppose its possible, but it might be the particular Dealer sold a few.
Brian
8227 8)


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: neil-yaj396 on 19 October, 2020, 06:30:18 AM
I first joined LMC in 1991 and remember getting the Challenge invite, so it was 91 or after....


Title: Re: Dedra turbo L148 SWS
Post by: frankxhv773t on 19 October, 2020, 04:46:41 PM
Dedra challenge was 1993 according to this.

www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Lancia-Dedra-Test-Drive-Challenge-1993-UK-Market-Mailer-Brochure-Pack-/183985810177